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HomeMy WebLinkAboutNovember 22, 2005 / PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING -NOVEMBER 22, 2005 The Regular Bi-Monthly Meeting of the Andover Planning and Zoning Commission was called to order by Chairperson Daninger on November 22,2005, 7:00 p.m., at the Andover City Hall, 1685 Crosstown Boulevard NW, Andover, Minnesota. Commissioners present: Chairperson Daninger, Commissioners Tim Kirchoff, Rex Greenwald. Dean Vatne and Michael Casey. Commissioners absent: Commissioner Valene Holthus. Also present: City Planner, Courtney Bednarz Associate Planner, Andy Cross Associate Planner, Chris Vrchota Others / APPROVAL OF MINUTES. October 25,2005 Motion by Casey, seconded by Vatne, to approve the minutes as presented. Motion carried on a 4-ayes, O-nays, I-present (Kirchoff), I-absent (Holthus) vote. PUBLIC HEARING: CITY CODE AMENDMENT TO AMEND CITY CODE 12-3-5 ZONING DISTRICT MAP TO REFLECT CHANGES TO FLOOD INSURANCE RATE MAP (FIRM) PANEL #270689 OOIOB. Mr. Vrchota explained staffis requesting this be tabled to allow City staff to amend the public hearing to include City Code Title 14, which is in regard to Flood Control Regulations. Motion by Greenwald. seconded by Casey, to table this item. Motion carried on a 5- ayes,O-nays, I-absent (Holthus) vote. Regular Andover Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting Minutes - November 22, 2005 Page 2 j PUBLIC HEARING: PRELIMINARY PLAT FOR STACK'S WOODS, A RURAL RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT LOCATED SOUTHWEST OF THE INTERSECTION OF 7m A VENUE NW AND 165m AVENUE NW. Mr. Bednarz stated the Planning Commission is asked to review a preliminary plat with 20 rural residential lots. The proposal is consistent with the Rural Residential Land Use Classification and Single Family Rural Residential (R-1) Zoning District that exist on the subject property. Mr. Bednarz discussed the stafIreport with the Commission. Commissioner Kirchoff asked if 164th Lane was a temporary cul-de-sac. Mr. Bednarz stated it was. Commissioner Vatne wondered if there was a sketch plan done previously. Mr. Bednarz stated they did not choose to go through a sketch plan process. Commissioner Vatne asked about the emergency vehicle access and he was confused as to where that fit in. Mr. Bednarz stated he did not know if emergency access would be the intent. They want to provide future access to the east and south. , / Commissioner Greenwald stated the way he read this is they are proposing 164th Lane is a temporary cul-de-sac. Mr. Bednarz stated this was correct. Commissioner Greenwald wondered if the lots to the east were single lots and he wondered if they know the developer is proposing putting a temporary 164th Lane with the potential of splitting their land in the future. Mr. Bednarz described the notification process and commented that phone calls had been received. Commissioner Greenwald stated the reason he brought this up was because usually when there is a temporary cul-de-sac for a future road, they have a ghost plat for surrounding properties which they do not have for this property. Commissioner Vatne stated there was another place referencing the review by the Lower Rum River Watershed District and he wondered if this review still stood. Mr. Bednarz stated they have reviewed this plan and are fine with it. Motion by Greenwald, seconded by Kirchoff, to open the public hearing at 7:11 p.m. Motion carried on a 5-ayes, O-nays, I-absent (Holthus) vote. Mr. Lon Bowls, 4995 159th Ave~ue, wondered at what point would the temporary cul-de- sac be opened to the south to Ventura Street because that is his driveway. Mr. Bednarz stated the property owners will decide when the road will be extended and at that point they will come to the City for approval of their project. . J Regular Andover Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting Minutes - November 22, 2005 Page 3 , J Mr. Bowls stated his driveway is actually an easement, a dirt road, not maintained by the City. Chairperson Daninger stated he would have to sell that property before the road would go through because he owns it. Mr. Andrew Millberg, 16491 Zuni Street, in the northwest part of the development, stated the entire area is virtually all trees and he thought there was a provision to preserve trees and he wondered if there was a way someone could buy the property and remove all of the trees and make it into a big field. Mr. Bednarz stated the developer has a plan for selective tree removal and will build around the trees to try to save as many as they can but when someone buys a lot, the City cannot force them not to cut down the trees. Mr. Perry Klinger, 16515 on the north side of the development, stated this area has been the drainage area over the years so they will need to be careful with elevations. He wondered if there will be drainage ponds on there. Chairperson Daninger stated the development cannot affect surrounding properties when developed. Mr. Klinger wondered where the water will flow to so it does not affect their property. Mr. Bednarz stated the developer will address the issue of drainage. Mr. John Ingle, 16415 Zuni Street, stated he saw on the map that there is a collection pond for run off. He wondered if this was intended to hold water continuously or would it be dry most of the time. Chairperson Daninger indicated the developer could also address this item. Mr. Helberg wondered if there will be any dredging of the wetlands to make them deeper. Motion by Casey, seconded by Vatne, to close the public hearing at 7:19 p.m. Motion carried on a 5-ayes, O-nays, I-absent (Holthus) vote. Mr. Mike Quigley, representing Emrich Development, stated they will have to maintain all drainage on their property, the depth of the ponds will hold water but his engineer could explain this item better and there is no dredging of wetlands but there are two minor fill areas that are in the area of street construction, but nothing that make lots come under the nonbuildable standards. He noted trees will be saved when possible and will be selectively cut. Mr. Brian Krystofiak, Pioneer Engineering, stated the treatment ponds will typically be dry because of the sandy bottom. The outlets are designed to be within a half a foot and will not be up to their full level at all times. He anticipated them to be dry most of the time. Commissioner Vatne noted on the tree preservation plan, he saw where they have taken the time to note the areas where each of the lots will be maintained. The areas he are concerned about is a mound of trees that will be lost, because of the need for the drainage and grading, much of the tree coverage will be taken away and he wondered if this is the case. Mr. Brian Krystofiak stated some of the lots will require fill to bring them up and a Regular Andover Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting Minutes - November 22, 2005 Page 4 i lot of the trees in those areas will be lost because of this. It depended on the lot layout but they would try to save as many trees as possible. Commissioner Vatne applauded the level of preservation they are trying to do and he thought this development was nicely done. He suspected and the language talks about a fair amount of work done to try to minimi7.e the variances. He wondered if there were any other plans that would come close to reducing the number of variances required. Chairperson Daninger stated with all of the development they have seen, they get landlocked with all of the long cul-de-sacs and he wondered if there was a plan, which did not have a long cul-de-sac. He indicated he would not mind having more variances for this development. Mr. Quigley stated there are two variances, one being the driveways onto the collector and the other was the long cul-de-sac. He stated if they were to pull the road back to shorten the cul-de-sac and put the lots at the end of the cul-de-sac they would eliminate the use of the property to east for access. He stated the only way into the property to east would be off of 7, if possible. He stated that is why it is platted showing a temporary cul- de-sac. He stated to put another street out onto 16Sth, there are only four lots along there. Because it being a rural development with those size lots, it is difficult to maintain the requirements. He noted they have looked at other options. Commissioner Kirchoffwondered what the width oflot number one was. He thought it was 400 feet wide. Mr. Quigley stated it was about that. Commissioner Kirchoff stated when they talk about long cul-de-sacs, it cannot be shortened otherwise there would need to be a road along each property. He did not think this standard could be applied equally to a rural development. Commissioner Greenwald wondered how many total acres this development was. Mr. Quigley stated it was roughly seventy acres. Chairperson Daninger stated his only concern was with the cul-de-sac. He stated he would like to see a variance go with a lot rather than with a long cul-de-sac. Commissioner Vatne stated when he first looked at this and looking at where a potential out street could go through, he found it would be along the property line, which would mean pulling in some of the four lots adjacent to 16Sth, which would provide an outlet to 16Sth. Commissioner Kirchoff wondered if this would affect the trees in the preservation plan. Commissioner Vatne thought they may have to be shifted a little. Commissioner Kirchoff wondered if this would affect the curve. Mr. Quigley stated the problem would be that it would be close to the existing home on 165th and they would be next to a curve and only be 350 feet from County Road 7 and it is not a good idea to come out at this point. . , / Regular Andover Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting Minutes - November 22, 2005 Page 5 Chairperson Daninger stated he liked the lots and tree preservations but not the cul-de- sac. Commissioner Casey stated he was comfortable with the way this is presented. Commissioner Greenwald stated he was struggling with the cul-de-sac. He stated they have seen this happen in a lot of plans. He stated the problem is that they do not know when the property to the east will development and it could end up being permanent. Commissioner Vatne stated he liked having a sketch plan in advance because some of the issues could have been taken care of sooner but he did like the plans and thought a lot has been put into the plans. He did not see any easy solutions to the cul-de-sac that would make sense. He stated he was comfortable with this plan. Chairperson Daninger stated he was going to vote against this because he was not in favor of the long cul-de-sac. Commissioner Greenwald stated he agreed because he felt the cul-de-sac will end up being permanent. Chairperson Daninger wondered if a neighbor would still have access from their driveway to the road. Mr. Bednarz stated they would. Motion by Greenwald, seconded by Casey, to recommend approval of the proposed preliminary plat subject to the conditions of the attached resolution. Commissioner Greenwald wondered if this eliminated the double frontage access. Commissioner Kirchoff stated because this is a large area, he did not think it would work. Motion carried on a 3-ayes, 2-nays (Daninger, Greenwald), I-absent (Holthus) vote. Mr. Bednarz stated that this item would be before the Council at the December 6, 2005 City Council meeting. PUBLIC HEARING: CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT (05-09) AMENDING CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT (05-08) TO ADD TELECOMMUNICATIONS EQUIPMENT AT 16191 ROUND LAKE BOULEVARD NW. Mr. Cross stated the applicant is requesting a change to an element of the CUP request that came before the City in August 2005 for the collocation of wireless telecommunications equipment at the American Tower site near the Industrial Park. Mr. Cross discussed the staff report with the Commission. Commissioner Vatne wondered why the footprint is larger. Mr. Cross stated he thought the applicant could answer this but he thought the technology being used is different. Commissioner Vatne stated this is adjacent to the Rural Reserve and he thought a smaller structure would be better. Regular Andover Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting Minutes - November 22, 2005 Page 6 Motion by Greenwald, seconded by Casey, to open the public hearing at 7:45 p.m. Motion carried on a 5-ayes, O-nays, I-absent (Holthus) vote. There was no public input. Motion by Casey, seconded by Kirchoff, to close the public hearing at 7:45 p.m. Motion carried on a 5-ayes, O-nays, I-absent (Holthus) vote. Mr. Dan Lesher, Cingular Wireless, 7400 Metro Boulevard, Edina, MN, stated the reason for the change is that because of the hurricanes, the cabinets are in high demand down south and they would not get the cabinets for three months or more. He stated the shelters are larger because they are prefab structures and the equipment inside the structure will be larger than what is placed inside the cabinets. He stated this will not be impacting the enclosed space. Mr. Lesher showed a sample of what the building will be like. Commissioner Kirchoff thought with the equipment being enclosed it would be protected better. He thought a shelter would be needed more in the hurricane areas. Mr. Lesher stated he did not know all of the reasons but cabinets are easier and quicker to install. / Chairperson Daninger asked who owned the tower. Mr. Lesher stated American Tower owns the tower and they lease space from them for their antenna Chairperson Daninger wondered if there would be any noise from an air conditioning unit in the summer. Mr. Lesher stated there is an air conditioning unit on the back side of the shelter and only used in the summer. He noted there is no more noise than an air conditioning unit on a house. He stated in the winter the equipment emits enough heat to keep it warm inside. Chairperson Daninger asked if there would be room to co-locate in the shelter. Mr. Lesher stated there would not be. Chairperson Daninger wondered if there would be any landscaping so it would not stick out. Mr. Cross stated they did discuss screening and the area is enclosed by a fence so it was decided there would not be any additional landscaping needed. Commissioner Vatne thought the structure would be an improvement. Motion by Greenwald, seconded by Casey, to recommend approval of the Conditional Use Permit Request. Motion carried on a 5-ayes, O-nays, I-absent (Holthus) vote. ./ Mr. Cross stated that this item would be before the Council at the December 6, 2005 City Council meeting. Regular Andover Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting Minutes - November 22, 2005 Page 7 " PUBLIC HEARING: CITY CODE AMENDMENT TO AMEND CITY CODE 12-7 TO REQUIRE A PERMIT FOR THE CONSTRUCTION OF A FENCE OR RETAINING WALL Mr. Vrchota explained the Planning Commission is asked to review a proposal to make two amendments to Section 12-7 of the City Code, which deals with fences. The ftrst amendment would make it necessary to obtain a permit before the installation of any fence or retaining wall in the City, and has been requested by the City Council. The purpose of this amendment is to give staff a chance to review the proposed location of a fence or retaining wall before it is installed, to prevent them from being installed in drainage and utility easements where they interfere with access to drainage ponds, sewer lines, and other utilities. Mr. Vrchota discussed the staff report with the Commission. Commissioner Kirchoff asked if this speciftcally states when or where a fence or wall can be installed or is this up to the City. Mr. Vrchota stated the fence ordinance was largely overhauled during the code updates and it does state where a fence or wall is not allowed. / Commissioner Vatne stated it sounded like this came about because of drainage issues and fences were installed and issues have come up because of this. Mr. Vrchota stated this code amendment would require any new fence or wall would require a permit so the City can check for any issues. Commissioner Casey wondered why they have two separate applications. Mr. Vrchota stated the purpose for the two different applications is because they have different information on them for fences and retaining walls. Commissioner Vatne wondered how far this will go in regard to smaller tiered walls on the property. Mr. Vrchota read what was required in the Code regarding retaining walls and what would be included or not included. It was noted small retaining walls for decoration or along homes would not need to have a permit. Commissioner Greenwald wondered if developers would need to get a separate retaining wall permit when building a house or would it be included in the building permit. Mr. Vrchota stated he would have to discuss this with the engineer to see what would be needed. He noted Mr. Bednarz indicated the Building Department reviews the retaining walls around the house as part of the building plan. Chairperson Daninger thought this was a starting point and can be reviewed in a year for additions or changes. / Regular Andover Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting Minutes - November 22, 2005 Page 8 Chairperson Daninger wondered if the fee was going to be $25.00 and is there any intent of putting the application on line. Mr. Vrchota stated it will be online and available at City Hall. Chairperson Daninger wondered when a resident gets a permit if the City will help them in locating property lines. Mr. Vrchota stated the City does not have the resources to determine this and the resident would have to do this on their own. He stated they can pull the plat for residents to determine where the property lines are. Chairperson Daninger stated the intent is to address the drainage issues and maintenance for the fences but it is the property owner's responsibility to locate the property line and call Gopher State One Call before installing a fence. Mr. Vrchota stated there will be no site inspections. The permit is to show they did get one and the plans for where the fence or retaining wall will be. Motion by Greenwald, seconded by Casey, to open the public hearing at 8:12 p.m. Motion carried on a 5-ayes, O-nays, I-absent (Holthus) vote. I Mr. Winslow Ho1asek, 1159 Andover Blvd. NW, stated he was at the City Council meeting where they discussed this. He stated this permit should not include farm fences. He thought it should state any "residential fence". Motion by Vatne, seconded by Casey, to close the public hearing at 8:14 p.m. Motion carried on a 5-ayes, O-nays, I-absent (Holthus) vote. Mr. Vrchota stated there is an exemption in the City Code regarding an exemption of keeping farm animals contained. Commissioner Kirchoff asked if a resident would need a permit for a fence around a garden to keep pests out. Chairperson Daninger did not think the intent was for getting a permit to install a fence there. Mr. Vrchota stated this has not been addressed and would have to be discussed. Motion by Casey, seconded by Vatne, to accept the amendments to City Code 12-7 to require a permit for the construction of a fence or retaining wall. J Commissioner Vatne stated initially when he looked at this, he wondered if this was more Government, bureaucracy, control or the right thing to do. He thought in this case it was being proactive to try to prevent major issues. He thought it was for the right purpose but he was very sensitive to the control piece. Commissioner Kirchoff concurred. He stated he was still concerned with someone walking into the Engineering Department and the City will not give them the benefit of doubt indicating it would never be tom down or driven upon but he hoped the City does not go too strong on one end of this and shut out properties because it still does concern him. Regular Andover Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting Minutes - November 22, 2005 Page 9 / Chairperson Danmger thought the intent was good and was creating new jobs for everyone but based upon trying to do better things he was not one for more rules and regulations but he was in favor of the motion. Motion carried on a 4-ayes, I-nays (Kirchoff), I-absent (Holthus) vote. Mr. Bednarz stated that this item would be before the Council at the December 6, 2005 City Council meeting. OTHER BUSINESS. Mr. Bednarz updated the Planning Commission on related items. Commissioner Kirchoff stated on one of the TV stations he noticed they were talking about the ISO ratings for fire and he looked at the internet and found that Andover had one of the highest ratings in the entire metro area and he was very impressed and proud to see that because it keeps their rates down. Chairperson Danmger concurred. J Commissioner Vatne wondered when the "Clocktower" Marquee will be going in. Mr. Bednarz stated there is no proposal at this time but he thought it would be worked out next year. Commissioner Kirchoff wondered if they should look at distinguishing between urban and rural areas when reviewing developments. Chairperson Danmger stated he thought this was discussed previously and at the City Council level and was indicated to leave it as is or not discuss or change it. Mr. Bednarz stated the Council did not want to change this. ADJOURNMENT. Motion by Greenwald, seconded by Kirchoff, to adjourn the meeting at 8:25 p.m. Motion carried on as-ayes, O-nays, I-absent (Holthus) vote. Respectfully Submitted, Sue Osbeck, Recording Secretary TimeSaver Off Site Secretarial, Inc. , /