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HomeMy WebLinkAboutJCC January 24, 2005 o o C) C I T Y 0 F NDOVE 1685 CROSSTOWN BOULEVARD N.W. . ANDOVER, MINNESOTA 55304 . (763) 755-5100 FAX (763) 755.8923 . WWW.CI.ANDOVER.MN.US Special Joint City Council/Park & Recreation Commission Meeting Monday, January 24,2005 Council Chambers 1. Call to Order - 7:00 p.m. 2. Discuss Andover Station North Park Facility - Andover Baseball Association 3. Update on 2005 Softball/Baseball Scheduling 4. Discuss Usage Fee for Youth Tournaments 5. Discuss the 2005-2009 CIP a. Discuss Lund's North Park & Prairie Knoll Park Lighting of Fields 6. Discuss Park Dedication Credit for Country Oaks West 7. Discuss Advertisements on Park Property 8. Andover Station South Park Dedication Allocation 9. Other Business 10. Adjournment C) c..~-c Cl<2.-/ LU1Ltttn do - / ~oS SPECIAL JOINT ANDOVER CITY COUNCIL/ PARK & RECREATION COMMISSION MEETING - JANUARY 24, 2005 MINUTES The Special Joint Meeting of the Andover City Council/ Park and Recreation Commission was called to order by Mayor Mike Gamache, January 24, 2005, 7:01 p.m., at the Andover City Hall, 1685 Crosstown Boulevard NW, Andover, Minnesota. Councilmembers present: Councilmembers absent: Commissioners Present: Don Jacobson, Mike Knight, Ken Orttel, and Julie Trude None Dan Masloski, Dave Blackstad, Devon Walton, Meg Dudgeon and Ernest Bedor (arrived at 7:05 p.m.). Denise McNeff, Jim Lindahl City Finance Director, Jim Dickinson Parks Coordinator, Todd Haas City Engineer, David Berkowitz Others Commissioners Absent: Also present: o DISCUSS ANDOVER STATION NORTH PARK FACILITY - ANDOVER BASEBALL ASSOCIATION Mr. Haas explained that this item has been requested by the Andover Baseball Association to be on the agenda. The Association has donated $40,000 towards the development of the park and would like the City to move forward with beginning to construct this project yet this summer. Mr. Haas pointed out that in reviewing the CIP, it is identified for 2009. If the project were to move forward this summer, the earliest the fields may be ready is 2007. r---., !J Mr. Deitz, President of the Andover Baseball Association, stated the Association has donated $40,000 toward the development of the park and has the intent of donating another $30,000. Their concerns were moving this up in the timetable. He noted they have limited field resources for the older kids, with only one full size field in the City available for the older kids to use. He stated they need to rent fields, but the problem with those fields is that they are not fenced fields. It is their goal to get this project moving forward with 300 foot fields, which would be true baseball fields and not multi-purpose fields. The Baseball Association did not use the current fields, except for five tournaments a year. He indicated currently, they have 600 kids between 8-12 year olds and they want to give them some fields to play on that are respectable fields. It is their goal to also have a facility that could be used by the high school students also. He noted football and soccer could also use the field when they are not using them. Having additional fields would also give the existing field a break in between sports. Local businesses in the community had also expressed interest in helping out. ,---.. \~ Special Joint Andover City Council / Park & Recreation Commission Meeting Minutes - January 24, 2005 Page 2 Commissioner Bedor asked if the existing fields could have fences added. Mr. Deitz responded they could not put in a fence because it is owned by the School District. He indicated they had offered to pay for the fence, but the School District did not want it. Last year they had to turn away kids because they could not provide sufficient facilities. He stated when they went to tournaments, they played on nice fields and he wants to be able to say they have the same type of facilities in this community. There are a lot of positives to having this type of a facility. Currently the total of kids they have playing baseball is approximately 860 and they expect this to grow annually. Councilmember Orttel asked what the cost of an outfield fence is. Mr. Deitz replied they had not priced this out, but they had looked at another field at Hidden Creek and a ten to twenty foot fence down each side was approximately $4,000. Councilmember Orttel asked if the problem with not having a fence is delineation or losing balls. Mr. Deitz replied those are part of the problem and there is also the issue of people walking into the field as games are being played. o Councilmember Orttel stated they need to look at the existing fields they have to see if they could convert or renovate them which would be considerably cheaper than adding new fields. He believed it would be cheaper to rent fields than build their own. Mr. Deitz replied their issue is that they need a whole field to compete competitively. They will lose kids because they will not be able to provide appropriate fields. He indicated they would need to share the high school fields. It is their goal to grow the baseball association into the top-notch association around and they cannot do that with inadequate facilities. Councilmember Knight pointed out there are many other communities that do not have separate facilities. Mr. Deitz responded they were not looking for the City to pay for this 100%, but they needed land and the go ahead to put the baseball fields in. Mayor Gamache stated they need to figure how development would go forward and the question is how to grade the whole area, and get in sewer and water. Mr. Dickinson stated they had talked to the EDA, and the EDA had a desire to pursue the completion of Jay St., ifit is financially feasible. He stated the residential component is solid and the land sale over the course of time would be 1.5 million dollars. The total improvements of Jay St. came close to 3.7 million dollars and if everything goes well, he forecast 2007 would be the earliest the fields could be available. They need to identify where the fields would be and how they would layout. He asked if the layout and design presented was appropriate, or was the design the Parks Commission saw over a year ago the design they want to proceed with. C) Mr. Berkowitz presented the current plan for the layout of the fields. Chairman Blackstad asked if they could not put in fencing at the high school and Oakview to satisfy the immediate needs. Mr. Deitz replied the fields would still be too small. ,~ Special Joint Andover City Council / Park & Recreation Commission Meeting \, 1 ----J Minutes -January 24,2005 Page 3 Mayor Gamache asked how field size affected grading. Mr. Berkowitz stated they want to make sure the fields drain properly, which is their main concern. Mr. Dickinson noted they are dealing with impediments, including electrical power lines. Mr. Berkowitz noted to make the fields work, they would need to accommodate sufficient parking also. CounciImember Jacobson believed the Baseball Association should sit down with City staff and work on this situation. He indicated he did not know why they are debating this. CounciImember Orttel asked why they could not upgrade the existing fields. He wants to make sure all of the fields are getting the proper use prior to building new fields. He expressed concern that the existing fields would be abandoned. Mr. Deitz stated some of the fields have safety concerns because of bumps, dips, and ridges, but those fields would still be used. o Mr. Haas noted some of the fields could be used for softball. Mr. Deitz stated the City is lacking in their facilities compared to other communities. He indicated they have the opportunity now to get this facility moving. He reiterated they had some money they are willing to invest. Mr. Dickinson stated the City did a detailed park study in 2002, including what the facilities are and what future facilities would be needed. CounciImember Trude asked if they would restrict their flexibility ifthey restricted the financing to park dedication fees from Andover Station North. She noted they should shuffle their priorities on the CIP. They all agreed when the high school came that the priorities would need to be reshuffled. She wants to see the City move forward with the project. C) Mr. Dickinson stated they need to balance the site and need fill and they would be able to pay for those costs due to the development of the park. There are particular guidelines and rules they have to follow, but the street connection and parking lot could be put in using increment dollars. The total cost for the park would be 1.4 million. He indicated a dual approach would be better to reduce the park budget by using tax increments for the infrastructure, such as the parking lot, but as far as the actual field construction and fences, they could not use tax increment. This would have to come out of the park budget from the park dedication fees. They need to try and stick to the CIP and make sure the park dedication dollars are consistent with the park study, otherwise they had to modify the study. Chairman Blackstad stated based on the study, some things could shuffle around. Mr. Dickinson responded that was correct. ,- '\ Special Joint Andover City Council / Park & Recreation Commission Meeting , '.J Minutes - January 24, 2005 Page 4 Councilmember Knight stated with the addition of the high school, the City had to step up and provide facilities for the kids who were coming up to high school. They need to support these kids because they would not be competitive if they did not adequate facilities to play on. Councilmember Jacobson clarified when they grade the site in 2005, the area where the baseball fields are going to be located would also be graded, and the Association should sit down with staff and get the fields oriented the way they want, which could also be accomplished in 2005, with irrigation of the fields in 2006 and playing on the fields by 2007. Mr. Berkowitz stated they need a field location within the next couple of weeks. Chairman Blackstad noted if they need to shift something to the west, they have the room to do that. Mr. Dickinson stated if they are agreeable to the number of fields and moving them to the west was one thing they need. He asked if they want 275 or 300 foot fields. The Council decided 300 foot fields. o Mr. Dickinson asked how they want the orientation of the fields. The Park Commission members asked this to be put on their first meeting for February for discussion. Councilmember Orttel stated if might be better if the Park Commission had a special meeting to sit down with the Association and discuss this. Mr. Dickinson asked if they want the future development funds to go to the development of this park, or should those funds go into the improvement fund. Mayor Gamache stated he believed they should use the park dedication fees. Councilmember Knight stated they should make this decision later on in the meeting when they discuss their other funding project. Councilmember Trude stated it is important the Council establish a priority for the Park Commission. Councilmember Jacobson stated it makes sense to have these fields a dual purpose with the football association. UPDATE ON 2005 SOFTBALL / BASEBALL SCHEDULING r-, U Mr. Haas explained that this item is in regard to an update of the toumament schedule and the regular schedule for the spring/summer season. He noted the tournaments for both the softball and baseball associations have been approved by the Park Commission. The regular schedule for the spring/summer season will be fmalized after registration is complete and the fmal number of youth () Special Joint Andover City Council/Park & Recreation Commission Meeting Minutes - January 24, 2005 Page 5 can be determined for both associations, so fields can be allocated accordingly. Mr. Haas noted the schedule of tournaments that have already been approved for 2005. DISCUSS USAGE FEE FOR YOUTH TOURNAMENTS Chairman Blackstad explained that this item is intended to give the City Council an update of the Park Commission's recommendation whether a usage fee for youth tournaments should be considered. He reviewed that at the December 16, 2004 meeting, the Commission recommended that there be no change in the fee structure for youth tournaments or associations at this time. Councilmember Trude asked how much staff time is devoted to the tournaments. Chairman Blackstad replied staff's time is minimal. He stated the associations are required to charge a tournament fee and this is a standard charge. Commissioner Masloski stated his employer charged a fee for tournaments because the fields needed to be maintained and the outside groups were charged the adult fee. C) Councilmember Knight stated it was his belief that Coon Rapids and Anoka did not charge fees. Commissioner Masloski replied his employer charged a set fee of$30.00 per day per field. He noted the average adult pays approximately $600-650 per weekend, while the youth pays $240.00 per weekend. Councilmember Orttel asked if they did their own maintenance also. Commissioner Masloski replied they were not allowed to do their own maintenance and this was taken care of by his employer, as well as picking up garbage. DISCUSS THE 2005 - 2009 CIP A. Discuss Lund's North Park and Prairie Knoll Park Lighting of Fields Mr. Haas explained that this item is to discuss the improvements that have been identified in the CIP for 2005. Two improvements identified in 2005 include field lighting for the two large soccer/football fields at Prairie Knoll Park and constructing a new parking lot and relocating the existing ballfield in Lund's North Park. As part of the Lund's North Park improvements, the Park Commission has recommended that a temporary parking lot (with Class 5) be installed south of the existing field until the spring season is over sometime in July and that "no parking" signs be installed temporarily on both sides of 166th Avenue NW and Zion Street NW as determined by the City Engineer. The relocation of the field and construction of the permanent gravel parking lot would start immediately following the end of the season. Mr. Haas noted Dmwing A of the reconstruction of the park that has been recommended by the Park Commission for the Council's review. o Councilmember Trude asked if it would be difficult to restore the part of the field that is a parking lot. Mr. Haas replied this would not be a problem or labor intensive. eJ Special Joint Andover City Council/Park & Recreation Commission Meeting Minutes - January 24, 2005 Page 6 It was the consensus of the Council to approve the temporary parking lot (with Class 5) be installed south of the existing field until the spring season is over sometime in July and that "no parking" signs be installed temporarily on both sides of 166th Avenue NW and Zion Street NW as determined by the City Engineer. The relocation of the field and construction of a permanent gravel parking lot would start immediately following the end of the season. With respect to the Prairie Knoll Park lighting of fields, Chairman Blackstad expressed concern that the entire Park budget for 2005 is being used for this project. Commissioner Walton noted between this project and the Andover Station South allocation, all of the funds would be dedicated and he was concerned about future projects. Councilmember Trude noted lighting of the field is one of the things that came with the building of the high school. Councilmember Jacobson stated at Andover Station South he believed there is still $100,000 available for this development. Mr. Dickinson replied he researched this and he could not fmd that the $100,000 was specifically dedicated through a motion, but if that was the understanding of the ,:=) Council, that this should go to the park dedication fund he could do that. Councilmember Trude believed when they were reworking the budget for the Community Center, they realized there would be more than $500,000 of park dedication funds available and the excess could be held to solve the Community Center overruns. Council member Orttel stated he believed the Park Commission had approved the lights. Chairman Blackstad stated he believed this came to the Council before it came before the Park Commission. Councilmember Orttel stated it was the Council's impression that the Park Commission had approved the lights and football field. Chairman Blackstad expressed concern about projects not being able to be funded because of this project. Councilmember Trude stated it ,was the Council's wishes that Prairie Knoll Park be completed. Chairman Blackstad asked if they need to put in curb and gutter the parking lot onPrairie Knoll Park considering this is a rural area. Councilmember Orttel stated in general he was not in favor of curb and gutter in the parking lot, but he would be in favor of delaying it instead of cutting it out. ::) Mr. Haas stated they had not contacted the neighbors at this time regarding the lighting and they would need to be contacted for their input. Councilmember Trude noted everyone in this area has security lighting, so she was not sure if this lighting would be a concern. 1" \J Special Joint Andover City Council / Park & Recreation Commission Meeting Minutes - January 24, 2005 Page 7 A member of the audience stated there were lights at the hockey rink, so he could not see how lighting the fields would make any difference. Mr. Haas noted the fields ars used until 10:00 p.m. Councilmember Knight pointed out the lighted fields have a multiple benefit. Mr. Haas stated the lights would need to meet City Code. An audience member noted right now the teams are traveling because they do not havelighted fields in this area. He stated the fields would probably be used four nights a week. Commissioner Bedor noted residents who moved next to a field should expect that at some point lights would go in. DISCUSS PARK DEDICATION CREDIT FOR COUNTRY OAKS WEST ;' '\ \J Mr. Haas explained that this item is in regard to discussing park dedication credit for the Country Oaks West development that will most likely move forward this spring. The developer has requested credit so that they can construct the park with the development improvements. He noted Jim Dickinson, Finance Director, would provide additional information to the City Council and Park Commission at this meeting. Mr. Dickinson wanted to point out a section in the park study where they need to set out the appropriate percentage of park dedication. He suggested they allocate to a developer about 45 percent of the park dedication be retained in the development. Chairman Blackstad stated the ultimate goal is to put the parks in as the development is completed. If the park was up and running as the development was going in, that helped the developer sell the property quicker, the tax base increased, and there were no issues in the future with residents who did not want the park located where proposed. City staff had agreed that they would monitor how this park would be graded and put in. The developer would put in the park and the City would have a balance coming in through park dedication fees to be used elsewhere. Councilmember Jacobson stated what they need to do is put something in the Ordinance or Code to set out how they went about determining how much money stayed and how much money went into the park dedication fund. Mr. Dickinson replied it was ultimately the Council's decision as to how these fees should be spread. CJ Chairman Blackstad stated the Commission intended on having a Work session to look at the CIP again. Councilmemher Knight noted this area is unique because of County Road 20, which is a very busy road and he did not want kids crossing this road. o Special Joint Andover City Council / Park & Recreation Commission Meeting Minutes -January 24,2005 Page 8 Mayor Gamache asked what the base is they should be looking at. Mr. Dickinson replied he was looking at 45 percent, but if there is a regional benefit of the park, then that would raise th.e number from 45 percent to another percentage. The Council was supportive of the plan and requested staffwork on a policy with the Park Commission. DISCUSS ADVERTISEMENTS ON PARK PROPERTY Mr. Haas explained that this item is in regard to considering advertisements on park property. The Park and Recreation Commission, during the past couple months, has discussed whether or not advertisements should be allowed in parks. Commissioner Walton has been taking the lead on this .and will be addressing the Council. " ) ,_/ Commissioner Walton stated the concept is to provide other possible revenue sources. They are looking at advertising on park benches, the hockey arena, and outfield fences. He noted they have a lot of industrial growth in the City who would like to advertise their business as well as show their support. He had called the City of Coon Rapids and they have a start up cost for the advertising boards on their fences. He had information as to who built the signs and what the hard costs were. He passed out rough estimates as to how much revenue could be generated by advertising. Councilmember Knight suggested the football poles could also be paid for by a business which could be advertised on. He noted they should not allow liquor or tobacco advertising. Councilmember Jacobson stated he did not have a problem with benches, but he did not want to see signs all of the way around outfield fences. Councilmember Trude stated she had also seen memorial benches done. She was concerned about the visual image of the community if they put advertising on the fences. Commissioner Masloski noted this would take a lot of staff time. Mr. Dickinson stated once a program is up and running, it would require minimal staff time each year. Commissioner Bedor stated advertising is necessary for businesses to survive and he was not opposed to advertising. He noted he did not see advertising as bad. Councilmember Knight noted all ballparks have advertising. o Councilmember Trude stated she wants public feedback on this proposal also. Chairman Blackstad stated they would look at this further and come back to the Council. Councilmember Orttel asked they also look at other Cities for their advertising policies. r " Special Joint Andover City Council / Park & Recreation Commission Meeting \._J Minutes - January 24, 2005 Page 9 Councilmember Trude does not like the idea of advertising on the fences, but could support some type of memorial advertising. Commissioner Bedor noted any funds received would benefit the City. ANDOVER STATION SOUTH PARK DEDICATION ALLOCATION Mr. Haas explained that this item is in regard to a question the Park Commission has raised regarding $96,144 for the Community Center contribution. .He drew the Council's attention to a memorandum from Jim Dickinson, Finance Director, regarding the allocation of the park dedication fees from the Andover Station South development. Councilmember Trude asked staff to look into this further. OTHER BUSINESS o Councilmember Jacobson asked if there was something the Council could do to improve or make the Park Commission's job easier or better. Commissioner Masloski stated he has been on the Commission for two years and he felt their hands had sometimes been tied. There are a lot ofthings within the park system that need attention soon and asked Council to fmd other revenue sources for the parks. They are trying to get the atWetic fields updated and new developments are going to be sitting without a park for five or six years. He noted there are parks that need to get done. Chairman Blackstad stated they had been performing a juggling act for the past five years and that some of the regular park projects had been delayed and now they had to try and bring those projects back in. . Councilmember Knight stated demands changed also with an aging community and this put the park demands into a cycle, which is where they are now. Councilmember Trude noted she had seen a lot of money put into park infrastructure over the past four to five years. Commissioner Walton stated he would like to see some type of a scoring system for the parks and work on the parks at the head of the list. Councilmember Trude indicated that was a good idea. o Chairman Blackstad intended on having a workshop meeting with the Commission to discuss this issue. :'t ~~ecial Joi~t Andov2e4r C210'fyOsCounCi! / Park & Recreation Commission Meeting _ i lVlinutes - January , Page 10 Councilmember Orttel asked who names the parks. Mr. Haas replied a lot of times they are named after the developer or development. Councilmember Orttel stated he had had an inquiry from a resident if a park could be named after a deceased resident who had lived in the area for a long time. He stated the City had lost some history. Mr. Haas replied generally the policy had been to have a dedicated tree with a memorial plaque. He noted the concern is if they have more than one request for naming of the same park, how they would choose which resident to name it after. Councilmember Trude suggested the park policies be looked at again. Chairman Blackstad stated they could add that to their March workshop. ADJOURNMENT Motion by Councilmember Jacobson, seconded by Councilmember Orttel to adjourn the meeting. The meeting adjourned at 9:30 p.m. /-, \. ,J Respectfully Submitted, Kathy Altman, Recording Secretary TimeSaver Off Site Secretarial, Inc. (,,)