HomeMy WebLinkAboutSeptember 27, 1977
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CITY 01 ANDOVER
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PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION
Regular Meeting - September 27, 1977
AGENDA
Approval of Minutes
1. Comm. #7-77-2
Oak Hollow Preliminary Plat Public Hearing
2. Comm. #9-77-2
Rum River Crossing discussion
3. Comm. #9-77-3
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Interim Moratorium Ordiance Public Hearing
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For publication of September 23, 1977
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CITY 01 ANDOVER
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REGULAR PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING
September 27, 1977
MINUTES
The Regular Meeting of the Andover Planning and Zoning Commission was
called to order at 7:30 P.M. by Chairman Larry Retzlaff on September
27, 1977 at the Andover Community Center, 1685 Crosstown Boulevard NW,
Anoka, Minnesota 55303.
Commissioners Present: d'Arcy Bosell, Walter Bruns, James Elling,
John Johanson and Ralph Kishel
Also Present: Rex Stockwell - City Engineer, and others
Minutes of September 13, 1977
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Corrections: page 2 - 4th paragraph - 1st line - should read: ~-acre
lots without sanitary sewer.
4th line - correct spelling: interfere.
7th paragraph - 3rd line - insert the word "and" between
'interest" and "r".
6th line - insert the word "on" between "and" and "a".
Motion by Commissioner Bosell, seconded by Commissioner Johanson, to
approve the Minutes of September 13, 1977 as corrected.
Vote on motion: yes - Chairman Retzlaff, Commissioner Bosell, Commissioner
Bruns, Commissioner Johanson, Commissioner Elling; present - Commissioner
Kishel. Motion carried.
Oak Hollow Preliminary Plat Public Hearing (Comm. #7-77-2)
Chairman Retzlaff opened the public hearing. The Commission received
revised copies of the plat. The revised plat has eliminated a small
park on l57th Avenue that the Park and Recreation Commission found
unacceptable so the developer is going back to the Park and Recreation
Commission to see if it would be feasible to give money in lieu of land
for the 6/l0ths of an acre park land needed.
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Engineer Stockwell reviewed his letter (copy attached) of 9-15-77 with
the Commission. He received the soil boring information tonight so didn't
have sufficient time to review it. Boring sites were: Test Hole #1 _
Lot 5, Block 2: water level at 7' below surface. #2 - on Lot 3, Block
2 on Ilex Street: 8' water level with no mottling. #3 - on Lot 1,
Block 1 on l59th Avenue: 9' water level and mottling was discovered
at the 4' mark; therefore there could be a problem with potential septic
systems #4 - Lot 4, Block 3: water at 8' and mottling at 3~'. This
would r~eire 2~~' to become bUildab.le.. It doesn't appear there will
be any p blem wi percolation tests. .d: , J
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Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting
Minutes - September 27, 1977
Page 2
Mr. Stockwell stated the following additional items should be taken
care of: #1 - park land; #2 - Coon Creek Watershed approval. Mr.
Orttel said the Watershed Board had approved the plat at their meeting
on September 26th and had said that all the water runoff would be
contained in the plat naturally and wouldn't need additional ponding.
Some of the land had been assessed in 1893 for the ditch but the area
not included in the assessments are going to have to be assessed now;
#3 - the cul-de-sac on l58th Avenue needs a 20' radius on lot 5, block
2; #4 - there are a few problems with the street profiles regarding
proper drainage, areas to be filled, culverts installed, etc., but
Mr. Stockwell will review this directly with the developer to take
care of them.
There were a number of adjoining property owners in the audience who
were concerned with the possible extension of l59th Avenue to the
West. Also mentioned was the future improvement of l57th Avenue as
a M.S.A.H. and the easements required. The property owners asked whether
there would be minimum house prices set, minimum house sizes, how
many new homes there would be, when the plat would be ready for building,
and how soon sewer and water might be coming with these additional
homes in the area.
Motion by Commissioner Bosell, seconded by Commissioner Bruns, to
close the public hearing. Motion carried unanimously.
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The Commission discussed: 648' on the cul-de-sac - ordinance 10
states ~~n~ length should be 500'; lot elevations; and lot frontages.
Additional items required: 1) street profile review by City Engineer.
2) review requirements of fill needed to bring the lots to 39,000
square feet of buildable land. 3) soil boring review. 4) the plat
will have to be resubmitted to the Park and Recreation Commission to
see of the possibility of giving cash in lieu of land for the :6 acres
of land. 5) the plat needs to be updated to show the soil borings.
6) additional review of the length of l58th Avenue - a variance may
be required. 7) the 20' radius on lot 5, block 2.
Motion by Commissioner Bruns, seconded by Commissioner Kishel, to
continue the plat until the next meeting on October 11, 1977. Motion
carried unanimously.
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Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting
Minutes - September 27, 1977
Page 3
Rum River Crossing Discussion (Comm. #9-77-2)
Anoka County Commissioner, Ed Fields, explained that in 1975
a letter was written to Richard Schneider, Andover Mayor, of the
County plans for a crossing. We have a resolution from the City
of Andover approving the concept of a crossing on the Rum River.
We have a contract for $7,000 for an environmental assessment.
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Anoka County Highway Engineer, Paul Ruud, said that the action
the City took in 1975 was in response to materials and a sketch
supplied which showed the possible crossing. Our sketch showed
the probable extension from the bridge to Bunker Lake Road.
Your minutes showed that you looked with favor toward a crossing
at County Road 20. Although the upgrading of County Road 20 is
in our thoroughfare plan, the traffic problems are now in the South
part of the City. We are trying to prepare a project development
report. This sets the scope of the project. We are looking at
improvement being done from 7th Avenue, at about 41st Avenue in
Andover and going west, across the river, into Ramsey on County
Road if57.
It was mentioned in your last minutes that construction would start
in the Spring of 1978. This is an error. Following preparation
of the project development report, it gets submitted to the State
Highway Department and many other agencies for approval. After
approval a public hearing will be held and then an environmental
impact statement is prepared. The scheduling is sometime in the
future. The work being done now will be completed and then when
funds are available everything will be ready.
Commissioner Elling stated the concern the Planning Commission
has about generating all the traffic into Andover from Ramsey.
Mr. Ruud said the traffic would primarily be on 7th Avenue into
Anoka or Highway 10. He told the Commissioners of the County
Thoroughfare Plan of 1974 showing the various roads in Andover
and the approximate time schedule for upgrading them.
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Commissioner Bruns asked what the direct advantage to Ramsey would
be and Commissioner Fields replied that the big thing is that the
high school students in Ramsey go to Anoka High School. Mr. Ruud
said that the Highway Department computer analysis shows delays
and hazards. Primary concern is the railroad crossings at Highway
#47. There are 27 trains crossing a day and the trains seem to
be getting longer. The County someday will build #47 across the
river into Champlin and Dayton, but it isn't in the 20-year County
Plan.
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Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting
Minutes - September 27, 1977
Page 4
The construction would begin 4 years from now at the earliest, probably
5 to 6 years. Until funds are available, it's not definite. There
would be 95% federal funding.
Bud Redepenning, County Highway Department, explained the process
involved with doing anything using federal funds. First we have to
have the project development report and get it approved. We are asked
what concurrence we have with the affected communities. We are now
at the first step - that there is a project in the mill and to explore
it. Then we would have a public hearing to get a location and design.
We need your approval or opinion of the concept of a Rum River crossing.
Keith Caswell, Consulting Engineers Diversified, said this (the project
development report) is an exploration stage. Depending on the various
agencies opinions will determine what steps we can take.
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Rex Stockwell, City Engineer, commented that in November, 1975, it was
first brought up. In December, 1975, there was a meeting asking whether
Andover ~nts a bridge. That was the first step. This is the next
stage. It was mentioned that Mr. Stockwell and the County Highway
Engineer confer as to the impact of the approach roads on the City
of Andover. The Planning and Zoning Commission would recommend the
City Council advise Mr. Stockwell to go ahead with the study.
Arnold Cox, Ramsey Mayor, said that this has been discussed for the
last 5 years. School safety is our number one concern. He advised
the Commission of the past history of communications between Ramsey
and Andover. Recently we had a joint meeting y~~ Anoka and a representative
from Andover concerning common problems. w, ~ CCorrec.+eJ 10-11-'>"')
Motion by Commissioner Bosell, seconded by Commissioner Kishel, to
resolve that the Planning and Zoning Commission recommend to the City
Council reaffirmation of the resolution in favor of the proposed Rum
River Crossing and recommend the City Council to direct the engineering
firm to look into the necessary data regarding the traffic and the
effect it has on the City.
Motion carried unanimously. This will be back on the City Council
Agenda on October 18, 1977.
Interim Moratorium Ordinance Public Hearing (Comm. #9-77-3)
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Chairman Retzlaff opened the public hearing. He explained that this
was referred back to the Planning and Zoning Commission from the City
Council. Onel of the primary concerns of the City is the development
of unservices areas of the Community that are zoned R-2 and R-3.
\ c.orrec.:teJ /0-1/-77
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Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting
Minutes - September 27, 1977
Page 5
Rosella Sonsteby, '~at was the idea of bringing it back again? I
thought it was settled." Chairman Retzlaff explained that the previous
interim moratorium was terminated July 1, 1977. Now the City has
considerable R-2 and R-3 zoning in the Rural areas that has dense population
that will require City services.
The Commission members, Mrs. Sonsteby and Mr. Stockwell discussed:
putting sewer and water in Section 30 so Mrs. Sonsteby can put in apartment
buildings; the intent of the moratorium; the Metropolitan Waste Commission's
boundaries for collecting the sewer availability charges; making all
the areas not sewered R-l zoning designations and when sewer becomes
available to zone the area correctly; the comprehensive sewer plan;
the Metropolitan Urban Service Area has a maximum sewer capacity of
31,000; the C.A.B. interceptor of, perhaps, 1990; stopping the premature
expansion of the sewer system; the 40 building permits a year required.
Ted Lachinski, Andover Councilmember, said that if consideration is
being given to restricting the development of plats in the urban service
area to 2~ acres, he would suggest that when a developer shows a 2~-
acre resubdivision plat it isn't very realistic; he thinks it would be
better to have R-3 or R-4 zoning and only build on every 2nd or 3rd
lot. Reason being that it makes it more expensive to everybody if you
have to pass some 2~-acre lots with running a sewer line.
Motion by Commissioner Kishel, seconded by Commissioner Elling, to
close the public hearing. Motion carried unanimously.
Motion by Commissioner Bosell, seconded by Commissioner Johanson, that
we accept proposed ordinance #2 - An interim ordinance regulating the
use and development of land within the City of Andover for the purpose
of protecting the planning process and the health, safety and welfare
of the City. - and change Section 4 to read "during the period of
October 18, 1977 through October 17, 1978:" and also "prior to October
18, 1977."
Vote on motion: yes - Commissioner Bosell, Commissioner Johanson,
Chairman Retzlaff, Commissioner Kishel; no - Commissioner Bruns; present -
Commissioner Elling. Motion carried.
This proposed ordinance will be on the City Council Agenda on October
18, 1977 for their consideration.
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Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting
Minutes - September 27, 1977
Page 6
Roth Special Use Permit (Comm. #8-77-5)
Chairman Retzlaff explained that this was referred to the Planning
and Zoning Commission by the City Council to check on the health,
safety and general welfare effects of the borrow pit on the community.
The City Council, as the Planning and Zoning Commission did, got off
the track of what the Special Use Permit is for. The landfill is a
concern but the mining permit for the borrow pit is the main subject.
Councilmember Lachinski stated, "There is no problem with the mining'
itself. There were several Council people concerned. We know where
the dirt is going. We should be looking at 2 different issues. It
is like adding gas to a burning fire. I would realize that you can't
get any more support from our City Attorney and I think you should
get another opinion. It is very important that the landfill meet
requirements in the future. I feel that the landfill should conform
in every way before the City should allow expanding the landfill.
I would request that the City consider a second opinion on whether
there are two separate issues or only one."
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The Commission reviewed the City Council Minutes of September 20,
1977. They agreed that the Special Use Permit request must be weighed
with the City's existing Ordinances.
Ron Roth, said that it is a very complex problem; but, Bob Hutchison
from the County was here at the public hearing and said nothing. Ed
Fields was here tonight and he didn't stay to say anything about the
landfill. Chairman Retzlaff: You are in here for a Special Use Permit
for a borrow pit on the adjacent 40 acres of land to the existing dump.
If the City does not grant it, you would not stop the dump, you would
probably truck in dirt and that would create traffic problems. Mr.
Roth: There is no restriction in any Ordinances where we get the cover
and certainly we have free access to the roads. The borrow pit would
be over 1400' from any residence. We are not going to dig a pit - it
will be a more level area. We try to go at the operation the best
way possible. We could have just gone ahead but we are trying to
comply with your ordinance.
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Commissioner Bruns and Commissioner Johanson mentioned that they were
not at the meeting where this was originally discussed, they had no
notification that it would be on this agenda and it should be continued
to perhaps get another opinion.
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Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting
Minutes - September 27, 1977
Page 7
Motion by Commissioner Bosell, seconded by Commissioner Kishel, to
resubmit to the City Council our recommendation as to the Melvin Roth
Borrow Pit Special Use Permit. Upon review of the Ordinance, the application
and it's end use are in conformance with that Ordinance (Ordinance 8,
Section 4.24) and therefore is not in jeopardy of the health, safety
and welfare of the community.
Vote on motion: yes - Commissioner Kishel, Commissioner Elling, Chairman
Retzlaff, Commissioner Bosell; present - Commissioner Bruns, Commissioner
Johanson. Motion carried.
This will be on the City Council Agenda on October 4, 1977.
Revised Zoning Ordinance (Comm. #6-77-6)
There will be a special meeting to review the new zoning ordinance
at 7:30 P.M. on October 4th at the City Hall.
Adiournment
Motion by Commissioner Johanson, seconded by Commissioner Kishel, to
adjourn. Motion carried unanimously.
Meeting adjourned at 12:00.
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Deloris J. son
Commission Clerk
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TKDA
TOLTZ, KING, DUVALL, ANDERSON AND ASSOCIATES INCORPORATED
ENGINEERS AND ARCHITECTS
'40B PIONEER BUILDING
SAINT PAUL, MINNESOTA
55101 224 -7891
TELEX 29-7461
Septennber l5, 1977
RICHARD M. BARKER
OWEN J. BEATTY
CARREL H. BERKOWITZ
ReBERT A. BOYER
JAMES C. BROTEN
ARNDT J. DUVALL
HUGO G. ERICKSON
WILLIAM J. FEYDER
ROYCE B. HANSEN
STEPHEN M. HARTLEY
WESTLY J. HENDRICKSON
CLIFFORD E. JOHNSON
OuWAYNE R. KASMA
J. THOMAS KIRK
DAVID W. KIRKWOLO
A. DEAN LUNDHOLM
ROBERT T. MALONEY
DENNIS R. MARTENSON
RICHARD Q. MENKEN
LEONARD G. MILLER
WAYNE A. OLSON
DUANE T. PREW
RUDOLPH P. RAITaR
ROBERT R. RYDER
WILLIAM H. SHERIDAN
JAMES A. SKARET
ABE J. SPERLING
ROBERT G. SPURR
WALTER W. THORPE
JAMES E. VOYEN
NATHAN F. WEBER
Planning and Zoning Connnnission
Andover, Minnesota
Re: Oak Hollow prelinninary Plat
Andover, Minnesota
Connnnission No. 6223-77
Connnnission Mennbers:
CLIFFORD W. HAMBLIN
EDWARD J. BOOTH
We have reviewed the prelinninary plat for Oak Hollow
Addition located in Section 13 north of 157th Avenue N. W.
The property is in an R-l Zoning District requiring a nnininnunn lot size of 2~
acres. The following are our .connnnents regarding the proposed subdivision
as prepared on August 26, 1977.
Gene ral Connnnents
1. 157th Avenue N. W. is a designated Municipal State Aid Roadway which
requires a right of way width of 120 feet. The developer has included
dedication of 60 feet width of right of way north of the centerline of l57th
Avenue as required for a State Aid Roadway.
2. The proposed subdivision is within the Coon Creek Watershed District.
A copy of the plat nnust be subnnitted to the Board for their review to
obtain approval of the plan.
3. Tennporary cuI-de -sacs will be constructed at each end of 159th Avenue
N. W. partly on tennporary easennents as indicated on the plat. At such
tinne as 159th Avenue N. W. is extended, the tennporary easennents would
be ternninated.
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o September 15, 1977
Page Two
Additional Information Required
The following information should be provided by the developer and indicated
on the preliminary plat:
1. Width and type of surfacing of 157th Avenue N. W.
2. Existing utilities including telephone and electric.
3. Drainage easement along ditch, 50' wide, at southeast corner of plat.
4. Drainage and utility easements, 10' each side of:
a) Lot line between Lot 2 and Lot 3, Block 1
b) Lot line between Lot 3, Block I and Park
c) Lot line between Lot 2 and Lot 3, Block 2
d) Lot line between Lot 5 and Lot 6, Block 2
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5.
Drainage and utility easement over west 50 feet of Lot 1, Block 2.
6. Future house on Lot 3, Block 2 must front on Ilex Street per Lot frontage
width requirement.
7. Existing and proposed street profiles including typical street section for
rural area, culverts (18" CMP) with flared ends, and other drainage
structures and ditch work.
8. Soil borings and percolation tests. Location to be obtained from
City Engineer. All borings must show mottling, if any.
9. Minimum basement floor elevation have been indicated. Revisions may
be necessary once soil information is obtained.
This letter will be reviewed with the Commission Members at the September 27,
1977, meeting.
Very truly yours,
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TOLTZ, KING, DUVALL, ANDERSON
AND ASSOCIATES, INCORPORATED
fii:jl rdi{/uft'L(
RWS:me Rex W. Stockwell
cc: Patricia K. Lindquist, Clerk
William G. Hawkins, Attorney
Clayton Orttel, Developer