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HomeMy WebLinkAboutAugust 3, 1995 o o o o o CITY of ANDOVER PARK AND RECREATION COMMISSION - AUGUST 3, 1995 MINUTES The Regular ai-Monthly Meeting of the Andover Park and ~ecreation Commission was called to order by Chairperson Tom Anderson on August 3, 1995, 7:35 p.m., at the Andover City Hall, 1685 Crosstown Boulevard NW, Andover, Minnesota. Commissioners present: Dave Erickson, Al Grabowski, Dave O'Toole, Roger Paulson Jeff Kieffer, Jim Lindahl Parks Supervisor, Kevin Starr Park Coordinator, Todd Haas Others Commissioners absent: Also present: APPRECIATION OF DONATION/ANDOVER LIONS On behalf of the Park and Recreation Department, Chairperson Anderson presented a certificate of appreciation to representatives of the Andover Lions Club for their generous donation to the Parks Department this year. Also, on behalf of the Andover Recreation and Development Association, Gary Shay, Vice President of the Association, presented a plaque of appreciation to representatives of the Andover Lions Club for their generous donation over the last few weeks and months to thJ Field of Dreams project. Mr. Shay also presented an award to Mark Drager, Andover Athletic Association, for the generous donations and contributions of money, resources and manpower of the Athletic Association for the Field of Dreams project. APPROVE QUOTES/WOODLAND MEADOWS PARK Chairperson Anderson reviewed what took place at the July 20 meeting with regard to this project. The Commission authorized up to $18,000 of park dedication funds for equipment and installation for the park. Mr. Starr looked at the design and layout for equipment and has presented a plan and a bid from another vendor to be considered tonight. The meeting was then opened to resident input. Jerrv Sobieck. 2159 172nd Avenue - stated his wife was supposed to be a member of the committee to work on Plans 1, 2 and 3 so the residents could vote. They met once, and then she went on vacation. The next thing they know, a plan has been presented and the neighbors didn't know anything about it. His wife contacted someone about a nature~park, who stated there must be a sponsor other than the City. A group of residents could sponsor it to maintain it. When he called City Hall to see if the item was on the last agenda, he was told it was not. That is ~ o () o Regular Andover Park and Recreation Commission Minutes - August 3, 1995 Page 2 (Approve Quotes/Woodland Meadows Park, Continued) why no one was at the last meeting. He didn't believe the park problems have been addressed. He was told the 10-foot setbacks from the property lines would be adhered to, yet a plan he saw puts things right up to his property line. It also shows all natural grass in the front, so his lot will then become the parking lot for those riding bikes. He felt the issue should be resubmitted to the entire development for a vote. The issue of safety has not been addressed with the vehicles traveling a minimum of 50 mph around the curve. If that is allowed to continue, some child will get hurt. Mr. Haas explained the Andover Review Committee has looked at the situation. He did a plan to install warning signs and reduced speed limit signs around that corner. He thought the speed limit will be 25 to 35 mph around the curve. The residents argued they are not enforceable. Mr. Haas stated they are enforceable. Also, the Committee has suggested "No parking" signs around the park and suggested the neighbors tell the City where those signs should be placed. Mr. Sobieck - again stated this is a park on a curve where the speed limit isn't controlled with no off street parking for cars or bikes. The City doesn't do a good job of maintaining the facilities it has, so how can it afford to put money into another park. He asked the ,r '\ Commission to consider the worst case scenario when making their ~ decision. Mr. Haas stated that is what is being done. Safety is first and foremost. Kevin Squier, 2138 172nd Avenue - was concerned with the 55 mph speed limit. He stated the 25 or 35 mph advisory speed doesn't mean anything. Mr. Haas again stated that is not true, that the speed limit is enforceable by the Deputies. Mr. Squier - explained at the speeds being traveled through there, the reaction time is limited and further reduced by other factors. He feared some child will be hit by a car. Also, at the June 15 meeting he left thinking three plans were going to be submitted and the residents would vote on the type of park they wanted. No one carne to his house to ask his opinion. Now neighbors have said they have $18,000 to spend for the park and people are out there measuring. Also, they left that meeting thinking all of them were going to be notified of the next meeting. He was not notified. He called the office and was told they were not on the Park Board agenda. Also, he didn't think the neighbors had the expertise to determine where the "No parking" signs should be placed. He didn't want parking on his side, but not on the other side either. ~) Discussion with the residents in general was on providing a parking lot and again on the speed limit through there. Mr. Haas again emphasized the advisory plates are enforceable for the posted speed. The Commission noted they did discuss installing one or two parking stalls. It was also suggested that the Commission determine where the "No Parking" signs should be located. Most favored parking on only one side of the street. The Commission also thought that the plan presented by Ms. Isaacson at the last meeting was the one agreed upon by the committee. Also, they are listening to the residents. o ,,-J :J u (,) Regular Andover Park and Recreation Commission Minutes - August 3, 1995 Page 3 \' (Approve Quotes/Woodland Meadows Park, Continued) Don Leverson, 17240 Partridqe Street - stated his wife was appointed to the committee. They met once. He understood Linda Isaacson was going to have the plan drawn up. Lori Sobieck was going to handle the nature portion of it, though she was going on vacation. His wife tried to find a middle ground of half park and half nature park. Some where along the line, Ms. Sobieck and his wife were left out and have been misrepresented and Ms. Isaacson appointed herself the spokesperson of the committee. He also thought there were going to be three plans presented to the residents for them to choose. Some where along the line the other two plans were trashed and Ms. Isaacson's plan was chosen with the two other people not involved. Chairperson Anderson stated the Commission was under the impression that the plan was a consensus of the committee. He thought the map in their packets was the vote. Annette Ward, 2070 172nd Avenue NW - stated unfortunately no one from the committee is present this evening, but she has been in constant contact with Ms. Isaacson. She went into considerable detail as she knew it as to who attended the meetings and what was done each time. To reach a consensus on a park plan, the basketball court was d+opped and it was agreed to go with playground equipment in the front and a nature area in the back, It was also agreed that Ms. Sobieck would contact a nature person and Ms. Isaacson volunteered to contact a vendor. Ms. Isaacson met the vender at the park and a plan was drafted for the playground equipment. She understood that Ms. Sobieck was unable to contact the nature center and then went on vacation. Ms. Isaacson then presented the proposal to the Park Commission and left with the impression that City Staff was going to get another bid proposal. That proposal is before the Commission this evening. The map given to the Commission was based on the original petition prior to the first meeting on this issue and was to show that a majority of the residents were in favor of a playground. It is also her understanding that the plans were based on a natural appearance of the equipment and the safety issues. They didn't notify everyone because it was felt a consensus was reached at that meeting. Debra Squier - noted the letter sent to all of the Commissioners. She contended there was no consensus at the committee meeting, yet here is the plan. They are still going to do the nature park. She asked how many are coming out to look at the park before voting on this issue. The majority of the Commissioners indicated they had already been there. Ms. Squier - felt it is important that they walk the lot and Ibok at the safety concerns. They are worried about cars speeding past there. They want no parking on the road at all and maybe parking inside of the park and possibly a fence. Mr. Sobieck - felt all of the residents should be able to see the plans for the park. He also thought they would vote no because there is no parking for cars or bikes plus the 55 mph through there. Also, without parking, the children will use his lot to park their bikes if there is natural grass in front. u ( '. v (J Regular Andover Park and Recreation Commission Minutes - August 3, 1995 Page 4 (Approve Quotes/Woodland Meadows Park, Continued) Chuck LaBeaux, 2233 173rd Circle NW - stated 41 people petitioned for a park and want one there. It is a designated City park and it should be developed as one, not left undeveloped for special interest groups. There is concern for speed, including himself; but what prevents those children playing hockey or basketball in the driveways from getting hit? He felt they would be safer in the park because it is off the road than they are in the driveways. He does have a problem with having to set up a corporation to sponsor a nature park and maintain it. What happens if those originally involved with the nature park move? A nature area is very high maintenance and he personally didn't think it is a feasible alternative for this piece of land. He saw it as a way of avoiding the development of a park. He thought the assumption that there would be a lot of cars parked around the park is incorrect. It was his opinion there would be a very limited number of people using the park, and not very many will drive to get there. Most people in the neighborhood will either walk or bike, so he didn't see parking as an issue. They have dealt with the speed limit issue, so just install the park. He didn't understand why children would place their bikes in Sobieck's yard rather than in the front of the park. o Mr. Sobieck - stated the original plan said the development would be 10 feet from his lot line with natural grass in the front, which makes it difficult to park bikes. Andover has already installed some shrubbery in parks, and he would expect the same protection to his property. Mr. LaBeaux - stated he was one of the first to build in there. This is not a unique situation. He stated the Commission has bent over backwards to hear the residents in the neighborhood, but he felt it is time to make a decision and get the park developed. The discussion continued with residents in the audience who opposed the park development and who restated many of the same arguments already expressed this evening. The Commission again noted it is a designated City park and felt it'should be developed. They also felt that there should be no parking along one side of the road, that the advisory speed signs should be installed, that the plan is to place for play equipment in the front and with consideration of a nature area in the back, and that Staff should look at the cost of installing a driveway parking area for two to three cars. Mr. Haas felt a two-stall parking area could be installed without disturbing the placement of the playground equipment. It could possibly be expanded to four stalls in the future. ~) Commissioner Grabowski felt it is probably more dangerous now with cars parking allover and children playing in the driveways than it will be around the park. At the last meeting, Ms. Isaacson did bring up a lot of points in defense of those wanting the nature area. Also, residents are not allowed to mow on any City property because of insurance regulations; however, the Adopt-A-Park program is in place to help keep the park clean. The Commission is aware of both sides of the issues. He agreed with the plan being proposed by Mr. Starr. ~ u C) \, u Regular Andover Park and Recreation Commission Minutes - August 3, 1995 Page 5 (Approve Quotes/Woodland Meadows Park, Continued) Mr. Starr discouraged the residents from the off-street parking because it can then become a hangout for some of the older youth. He felt it will be a very nice park with very little disturbance to the area, and it will be used mostly by their neighbors. It will be mowed; natural unmowed grass cannot be left in the front. Some of the trees will be trimmed, though the intent is to leave an undisturbed area along the sides as a buffer for the neighbors. The equipment is designed for the 5 to 12 year olds with cedar in the front. A second phase could be added for a tot lot, probably to the west. It will be ADA accessible with a hard-surfaced access. Fences have not been put around parks, though a split rail fence would look nice along the front of this. The land will have to be brought up about two feet, then seeded. He proposed having bluebird houses in the back, park benches, etc. The total bid from Minnesota Wisconsin Playground, Inc., is $14,384.52 for equipment, plus $3,218 for installation. Mr. Sobieck - felt the biggest problem in this entire issue has been miscommunication on everything. (j MOTION by Erickson, Seconded by Grabowski, that we go ahead with the proposal from Minnesota Wisconsin Playground, Inc., in the amount of $14,384.52 and the installation of $3,218; and along with that provide for two parking stalls off street. Install the speed signs as Mr. Haas is recommending; then provide for "No Parking" on both sides of the street. Motion carried on a 5-Yes, 2-Absent (Kieffer, Lindahl) vote. The Commission noted the discussions have been to develop a nature park in the back. They wanted to minimize the loss of any trees, and noted the difficulty of putting something in the back for safety and security reasons. For now, $18,000 for development of one park is a lot. A main focus for the budget is to complete the Field of Dreams complex across the street. ... (Commissioner Erickson left the meeting at this time, 9:00 p.m.) PARK AND RECREATION DEPARTMENT DISCUSSION u Mark Drager, Andover Athletic Association, explained the Association provides sports programs for the youth of the community on a voluntary basis, and they depend on the City for help. It is getting to the point where someone is needed on the City Staff to dedicate more time to help these programs succeed. This person would coordinate the various programs. He has talked with the City Administrator about the issue, and he suggested coming to the Commission first. Mr. Drager stated he has volunteered almost 1,000 hours this year. with the new fields, there will be people asking for adult leagues, and someone is needed on Staff to coordinate that. The primary focus, of course, would be the youth programs. The athletic associations would still be in place, but u o , '\ U Regular Andover Park and Recreation Commission Minutes - August 3, 1995 Page 6 \' (Park and Recreation Department, Continued) help is needed from the City to keep them going. It is a combined effort. He has called other communities to find out how they run those programs. Some are done through community education, some through Park and Recreation Departments and some through athletic associations. But all of them had someone in the City that works closely with the athletic associations. There is a good core of volunteers in the athletic associations, but someone is needed for more help from the City. Some of the monies going to community education could be funneled to this position. In other cities, the position is self-sufficient through various fees. Commissioner Paulson felt that with the increase in population, Andover has outgrown volunteerism. It is time for a Park Coordinator, and he thought it should be presented in the budget for 1996. The Commission generally agreed. They noted this position is needed to help with the scheduling of the fields, work with adult leagues, handle users fees, plan other programs for park activities, coordinate the concessions stand, work with budget activities and grant applications, etc. It was also argued that a full-time position is needed now. The tommission suggested the issue be raised with the Council at their August 7 budget meeting as well as provide a written job description of the position. (J ORDINANCE 10/PARK DEDICATION FEES DISCUSSION The Commission noted that there appears to be a disparity between park dedication fees of $400 collected for a lot split and up to 10 percent of the property value collected for plats. The Commission agreed to delete the last paragraph of 9.07.10 relating to subdivisions by metes and bounds and to rewrite it with park dedication fees being subject to the same as platted property. The park dedication would apply to all property involved in the metes and bounds subdivision. MOTION by Paulson, Seconded by O'Toole, to eliminate that paragraph. Motion carried on a 4-Yes, 3-Absent (Erickson, Kieffer, Lindahl) vote. APPROVE FENCING PLAN/IP93-7/CITY HALL PARK COMPLEX #2/FINAL PHASE " ) \.__/ The Commission generally preferred the type of dug outs that are in City Hall Park Complex #1 and agreed to have the same type put in the Field of Dreams complex. They also agreed to Option 1 for ferlcing, but eliminate the fencing between the fields. The fencing, then, would only be the length of the in-fields going to the south. They felt that makes it easier for maintenance and that it would not matter if a ball came into the tar walkway occasionally. Fencing can always be added if it becomes a problem. The east side would be totally fenced with a six- foot fence. It was also suggested that consideration be given to providing a removable gate at the main entrance of the fields, such as a double 4-foot gate to close it in the winter and remove it during the sports seasons. Mr. Starr stated he would check into that option and also look at doing something to highlight the main entry. (J o :,) Regular Andover Park and Recreation Commission Minutes - August 3, 1995 Page 7 (Approve Fencing Plan/IP93-7/City Hall Park Complex #2, Continued) Commissioner O'Toole suggested the bituminous path be offset to one side to allow for parking up to the fence in the winter and to provide a pad for turning around for trucks delivering to the concession building, etc. Mr. Haas stated they would look at that. He will also obtain quotes for this phase of the fencing. CITY HALL PARK COMPLEX 12/PARKING LOT DISCUSSION \, Chairperson Anderson explained he met with the City Administrator today, who advised that he would not recommend the use of TIF funds to blacktop the parking lot at the Field of Dreams. It was the Commission's understanding that that expense would come from TIF funds. Had they known and given the choice, the preference would have been to use TIF funds to pave the Field of Dreams parking lot, not the street and parking lots at City Hall Park Complex #1. The estimated cost for bituminous at the Field of Dreams parking lot is $86,000. Mr. Haas stated the Class 5 is in and will be paid for either from TIF or by the contractor. Commissioner O'Toole noted the Class 5 there now :) is considerably less than what was there before the sewer project. Mr. ~ Haas stated that will be brought up to the original specifications, as the contractor has an obligation to replace what was taken out. Mr. Haas also explained the memo from City Engineer Scott Erickson with the proposal to add an additional row of parking by adding 10 feet to the parking area and to install the conduit for future lighting. The parking lot expansion is estimated to be an additional $7,000 and the installation of conduit an additional $3,920. It would increase the parking from 244 to about 270 stalls. ~ The Commission was disappointed with the financing, as they were under the impression that all bituminous would be picked up by TIF funds. In a cursory review of the park dedication funds to date, with all obligations and proposed expenses, it was thought the fund would be depleted. It was suggested the Commission bring this item to the City Council at the budget meeting on August 7. Another suggestion was to have the item placed on the next Council agenda to ask that the Council consider the use of TIF funds to pay for the bituminous as originally understood. The Commission asked Mr. Haas to check with the Finance Director for a more specific accounting of the park dedication fund. No decision was made on the City Engineer's proposal. , " J ,_/ \, - " , '-../ , .... ',-_J (J , .... ( . \...,) ) Regular Andover Park and Recreation Commission Minutes - August 3, 1995 Page 8 \. CHAIRPERSON'S REPORT Mr. Haas noted the developer of Fox Woods was asked to remove the bridge over Coon Creek before park dedication was accepted. In inspecting the bridge, Staff found it to be solid and recommended it not be removed. It could be used as a crossing over the creek as the walking and biking paths are developed. MOTION by Paulson, Seconded by O'Toole, to adjourn. Motion carried on a 4-Yes, 3-Absent (Erickson, Kieffer, Lindahl) vote. The meeting was adjourned at 10:18 p.m. Respectfully submitted, ~~Ch~~ Recording Secretary \, \,