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Home My WebLink AboutSP November 29, 1994 CITY of ANDOVER ANDOVER SPECIAL CITY COUNCIL MEETING AGENDA November 29, 1994 7:00 p.m. 1. Call to Order 2. Discussion - On-Site Septic Systems/Ordinance No. 37. 3. Adjournment - .. : '~ ,., ,. .;. ,': '.:, ~ ' . . , CITY of ANDOVER ~ 1685 CROSSTOWN BOULEVARD N.W. . ANDOVER, MINNESOTA 55304 . (612) 755-5100 SPECIAL CITY COUNCIL MEETING - NOVEMBER 29, 1994 MINUTES A Special Meeting of the Andover City Council was called to order by Mayor Jack McKelvey on November 29, 1994, 7:05 p.m., at the Andover City Hall, 1685 Crosstown Boulevard NW, Andover, Minnesota, for the purpose of discussing septic system inspections and mandating the pumping of 0 those systems. Councilmembers present: Dalien, Jacobson, Perry, Knight Councilmembers absent: None Also present: City Planning Director, Dave Carlberg City Building Official, Dave Almgren Representatives from septic system pumping companies: Stan Roshan, Stan's Line Cleaning Jim Lashinski, Lashinski Septic and President of Minnesota On-Site Sewage Treatment Cont. James Kopet, A-Northern Cesspool, Inc. Dave pehlke, D.J. pehlke Septic Service Merlin Brisbon, Sewerman Mario Giordaino, Sewerman Ken Kiese, A-I Sewer Service Jerry Helm, Dan's Sewer Service Gene Gargis, Ace Cesspool Others Mr. Carlberg summarized the Council's previous discussions on the new policy of the Metropolitan Council, as a part of the Comprehensive Plan process, that requires the City to implement either inspections or mandatory pumping of all septic systems in the City biennially. Questions have been raised on the cost of inspections versus actual pumping, and those present were invited to provide their expertise in the area of septic systems. Mayor McKelvey also stated he would like to see a dumping station placed in Andover, located behind the Public Works building once the sewer line is extended, which would reduce the time, travel and expense for the pumpers. Hopefully, some of that cost savings would be passed on to the Andover residents. That would be on a main City trunk line, which is a part of Metropolitan Waste. In discussing the issue with those pumpers present, the following points were brought up: The average rate for pumping a septic system is $100 to $150, depending on how many tanks, the size of the tanks, and other factors such as the location of the system. To inspect a tank would also cost about $100, but that too depends on what they would be required to inspect for. Very few of the companies represented had staff that were inspectors licensed by the PCA. Those present questioned the validity of inspections, as a system can be polluting in , ~~~ 1':)./~o/q'1 -~ ._--.. ~ -. - .- ---_._- , Special City Council Meeting Minutes - November 29, 1994 Page 2 so many different ways; it is difficult to determine if a system is operating; plus it can give a false sense of security to the owner. Another question is does a system fail an inspection because it does not meet today's installation codes? It was stressed by the pumpers that education and regular pumping are essential to maintaining a functioning septic system over an extended period of time, though there are those systems that were installed poorly. Another problem is if the inspections are left to the pumpers and a pumper has to fail a system, that pumper will not get any more business in that neighborhood. If a tank is pumped before an inspection, there is no way to know if the drainfield is working. Inspections should be done before the tank is pumped. Pumping every two years for a two-tank system and every year for the one-tank system is good for the homeowner, good for the aquifer and environment and good for business. The pumpers had some disagreement about whether or not it is necessary 0 to dig up the ground to inspect. Some said 95 percent of the septic systems are pumped through the vent pipe. Others disagreed, that their policy is to pump through the cover, backflush and rinse. The importance of proper installation of a system was again noted, stressing the superiority of a two-tank system to allow purification before entering the drainfield and the need to install the drainfield to meet or exceed specifications. Several pumpers also noted that Andover already has provisions in place for homeowners to inspect every two years, and they do get many calls as a result. Plus other cities are beginning to follow Andover's example in that area. Another felt that in order to keep the systems operating satisfactorily and to keep the environment from being polluted that biennial pumping should be made mandatory. Councilmembers noted the policy in place is not satisfactory to the Metropolitan Council because there is no follow-up. The discussions seemed to indicate that biennial inspections are not feasible economically for the homeowner, but the Council questioned the need to pump a system that often. Those present gave instances of improper installations; reviewed some of the current requirements for the proper installation of a drainfield; again emphasized their opinion for the need to pump a one-tank system every year and a two-tank system every two years; noted the only way to cut down pollution is by pumping, not by inspections; claimed that there is pollution whenever there is a concentration of people and septic systems; cautioned that pumping doesn't stop a system from failing; noted some other cities that require they be notified if a pumper finds a failed system within the community, which they felt is a good policy; again stressed the need to educate septic system owners on how to care for the system, though the Council noted that option alone is not available; and pointed out the economics of $100+ per year for pumping to save the environment plus create a valuable industry. Councilmember Jacobson saw the City had two options: 1) Continue with the existing policy but track the systems on the computer. The homeowner could chose to either have his/her system inspected or to have it pumped biennially. If it is not done, the City would send out a , Special City Council Meeting Minutes - November 29, 1994 Page 3 second notice that if it still is not done, the City would have it done with the costs assessed against the property. That way the homeowners have an option and the City does not get involved with charging residents, etc. 2) Refuse to comply with the Metropolitan Council's demands and live with the consequences of no further MUSA expansion for awhile. Several pumpers suggested the City provide a handout to septic system owners on the use and maintenance of their septic systems and the damage that can result if they are not pumped regularly. Mr. Carlberg stated information is sent to them when they are notified every two years to check their systems. Mr. Almgren stated there is the capability of tracking this on the computer, but Staff does not have time to track it. One resident in the audience commented that imposing the additional cost of inspecting or pumping would financially force him to move. Lyle Bradley stated he's lived at his place since 1955 and had to have the septic system redone within two years. He then had a second line for ' the wash water and put in an additional tank, and the system has been pumped only once since 1958. He argued with proper care and careful use of what goes into the system, there is no need to pump as frequently as those present have advocated. Ken Orttel stated the current policy was instituted to educate the owners and to keep track of the failures. He asked how many failures there are a year in Andover. Mr. Almgren estimated two or three. Mr. Orttel didn't see a problem and to put everyone in the City through this seems to be ridiculous. The Metropolitan Council has tried to extort a few things from the City over the years, and the City has always gotten around it. Typically when systems fail, new ones are installed. Most wells are deep, and with the new installation requirements for drainfields, it doesn't seem that any real pollution is being created. The Council did not wish to act on this item tonight, and thanked the pumpers for their opinions and sharing their knowledge in this area. Those present advised the Council that serious consideration should be given to the pollution to avoid creating the same situation which involved the landfills, that pumping every year or two is an answer to that pollution, but at the same time do not impose more government on the people or be held hostage to the Metropolitan Council. One observed that most people simply procrastinate when it comes to pumping their 0 systems and that the key is to educate, educate, educate! Mayor McKelvey noted information can be placed in the City newsletter in January and again in March. The Council recessed at 8:30; reconvened at 8:40 p.m. Councilmember Knight noted the Safety Committee has received an appeal of a suspension from Firefighter Bob Peach. He and Councilmember Perry felt the issue should be heard by the entire Council. The Council agreed and asked Staff to add it to the December 6, 1994, agenda if Mr. Peach is able to attend that meeting. Staff was also asked to make copies for the other Councilmembers of the material sent to the Safety Committee by Mr. Peach. -- --~ -. .--...-..---- -~- / 0 Special City Council Meeting Minutes - November 29, 1994 Page 4 MOTION by Jacobson, Seconded by Perry, to adjourn. Motion carried unanimously. The meeting adjourned at 8:44 p.m. Respectfully submitted, ~~~J- Recording Secretary 0 0 - . . .- -. - .._--_. -----