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HomeMy WebLinkAboutPH February 18, 1988 ..CÁ.."\ CITY of ANDOVER Q , ..\,.,~: PUBLIC HEARINGS _,iF' FEBRUARY 18, 1988 "~1";;.'1'~'" l. Call to order 2. Langseth's Pine Acres/IP87-26 - 8:01 P.M. 3. Hawk Ridge/IP87-23 - 8:30 P.M. 4. Bluebird, Yellow Pine, Ward Lake Drive/IP88-2 - 9:00 P.M. 5. 6. Adjournment @\\ CITY of ANDOVER { :'~ .;; 1685 CROSSTOWN BOULEVARD NW, . ANDOVER, MINNESOTA 55304' (612) 755-5100 .../ '~,-.;i-;~';/;' PUBLC HEARINGS - FEBRUARY 18, 1988 MINUTES PULsuant to notice published theLeof, PubJic HeaLlngs fOL stLeet construction In Langseth's Pine ACLes, Hawk Ridge, Bluebird, Yellow Pine and WaLd Lake DLive areas weLe called to oLdeL by MayoL JeLLY Windschitl on FebLuaLY 18, 1988, 8:00 p.m., at the AndoveL City Hajj, 1685 CLosstown BoulevaLd NW, AndoveL, Minnesota, Anoka County. Councilmen pLesent: Apel, Ell ing, Knight, OLttel Councilmen absent: None AJso present: BRA EngineeL' Glen Cook; City Clerk, VIctoria Volk; City AdmlnistLator/EngineeL, James Schran tz ; and others LANGSETH'S PINE ACRES/IP87-26 MayoL Windschitl Leviewed the proceduLe and geneLal policies fo110wed by the City LegaLdlng ImpLovement pLoJects. M.. Cook then reviewed the pLoposed stLeet improvement pLoJect in Langseth's Pine Acres. The estimated cost of the pLoJect is $115,542, which amounts to $2,140 fOL each of the 54 units. They used the oLiginal lot size when deteLmin- ing the numbeL of lots on the pLopeLty west of POppy. Because most of the oLiginal lots have been combined with anotheL lot, most lots wi II Leceive an assessment for at least two units. The Ci ty will also pal' for the assessments for the paLk pLopeLty. M.. Cook anticipated beginning constLuction the beginning of Mal' and completion in July if the pLoJect is ordeLed this evening. Testimony was then opened to the public. David Lanaseth. 3385 174th Avenue - asked how the costs weLe deLived. M.. Cook explained the cost peL lot was deteLmined on the completed proJect costs Including cost peL ton of gravel base, mix, shouldeL material, gLading, etc. He also expJained the bidding proceduLe. John RenCfo. 17425 MaLlaold StLeet - asked if any consideLation as given to the dLainage in the area. He said there aLe many culverts that do not work, the ditches aLe ful I when it rains haLd, and a few houses in the area do have wateL problems. He though t this should be addressed with the proJect. M.. Cook stated they didn't include any costs to improve the dLainage nOL clean the culveLts, though they can see if any maintenance should be done to corLect those pLoblems. Lee Buttwei ¡ere 3271 174th Lane - stated the Load gets covered in front of their house in the spLlng, noting the water stands about two weeks and nOLmaJly goes away. He aJso noted the direction of most of the dLainage and felt theLe needs to be a culvert to drain off wateL coming fLom the paLk. -- PubJic HeaLings February 18, 1988 - Minutes Page 2 (Langseth's Pine Acres, IP87-26, Continued) M.. Cook stated no further culveLts were planned. They would have to clean the culveLts and do some minimum gLadlng to pull the slopes back. Counc i 1 agreed if It is a seveLe pLobJem, it should be addressed at this time. Mr. Lanaseth - expJained the drainage goes to the COLneL of Round Lake Boulevard and 173rd. He stated theLe is no problem with the depth of that pond, Just getting the wateL to It. Alice Kina. 3354 174th Lane - stated she has a fLiend on 173Ld who had to to have her septic tank pumped twice In three days because of the wateL from heL area draining over there. M.. Buttweiler - stated the wateL Is supposed to fJow on the tier of Jots west of MaLigold wheLe theLe Is a swale. TheLe's a cuJvert undeLneath 174th Lane, but in most cases the culverts aLe ful 1 of sand and don't work. M.. Schrantz stated that should be taken care of with or without the proJect. Ken Anderson. 3207 174th Lane - thought the costs weLe high, asking what would happen if city seweL and wateL came thLough. MayoL Windschl t J stated the ability fOL the City to bring seweL to that area is, for a] I practical pULposes, nonexistent, and explained the I iml ts for capacity given the City by the MWCC. Mr. Anderson - asked how the prices in Woebegon Woods compared with this. M.. Cook didn't LemembeL the unit pLices, but these aLe higheL because of higheL costs in mateLlals. He also explained the bidding process and selection of a contLactor fOL city pLoJects. Euaene Oleson. 17361 TuJip - also felt part of the problem is wi th the culveLts. His land Luns the full length of Poppy StLeet. He felt $12,000 OL $14,000 was a high pLice to pal' for that street, stating he doesn't even use Poppy Street. M.. SchLantz stated ML. Oleson was assigned six units, each the same size as the other units In the area. Mr. Oleson could build three houses if he were LequlLed to build on eveLY other lot. He could only build two houses if 2 1/2-acre lots were required. AnotheL alteLnatlve would be not to chaLge fOL that vacant land but determine the lot costs In the proJect using six less units. Counc i ] deteLmined if those six units were dLopped fLom the proJect, It would add appLoximately $267 peL lot. It was also noted in eveLY case except one, there Is one house on every two lots. There is one instance of a house on a singJe lot. Severa] residents stated they do not have two lots, as they were required to combine the vacant Jot with that of thelL house. M.. SchLantz explained they made those lots two units to make the assessments mOLe unifoLm. Publ ic Hearings February 18, 1988 - MInutes Page 3 (Langseth's Pine ACLes, IP87-26. Continued) Bill CalLns. 3339 174th Lane - felt the biggest pLoblem Is the dust problem cLeated by people using 174th Lane, down Poppy to 173rd. They receIve a lot of tLaffic because of that. He pLoposed putting a cuI de sac at the end of the park to el imlnate the through stLeet and to Leduce the amount of tLaffic cutting thLough theiL development. He didn't feel a cuI de sac would cLeate any problems. Ms. Kina - stated because of the nice CULve and good bank, kids and those wi th three and fouL wheeleLs love to play on I t -1- - agreed wIth the cuI de sac pLoposal. thinkIng it would eliminate the dust and tLaffic pLoblem. Wanda Saukola. 3301 174th Avenue - didn't need the race tLack, also agreeing the cuI de sac would be a good Idea. M.. CaiLns - stated the tLafflc goes back and fOLth on their stLeet even at 1 , 2. OL 3 o'clock in the mOLnings. A cui de sac would pLevent them fLom going thLough and would stop that tLaffic. He fe It most of that tLaffic is not fLom theiL neighboLhood. MayoL Windschitl explained cuI de sacs aLe veLY expensive to build, being Loughly the equivalent 300 feet of stLeet. Ms. Saukola - asked if theLe would be an adJustment to the dLiveways I f the Load wi II be 6 Inches higheL than at pLesent. M.. Cook explained they would match back to the dLiveways that aLe theLe. They raise it up to take advantage of what Is theLe now. If theLe is a pLoblem with a paLtlculaL driveway, they wi] I adJust to fit it. -2- - asked i f the paving wi] I go up to the pLopeLty J ine. M.. Cook explained they come back at least 10 feet Into the dLlveway. M.. SchLantz that could be a variable cost If someone would what addl tionaJ blacktop OL to match what they have. -2- - asked about the top soi I on the boulevaLds. Mr. SchLantz PLefeLLed using topsoil and seed up to the bJacktop. M.. Cook explained the estimate includes doJlars fOL graveJ shouldeLs; but I t is a littJe cheaper to go to the edge of the blacktop with soil and seed. -2- - asked if the cost of the pLoJect would incLease drastically if it is not done this yeaL. M.. SchLantz stated It depends on the pLice of oil. Council then discussed the numbeL of units to be assigned ML. Oleson, agreeing to assign 2 lots of 2 units each, for a total of 4 units. It was deteLmined that would change the peL-unit cost fOL eveLyone in the pLoJect to $2,222. Pub]ic HeaLlngs FebruaLY 18, 1988 - Minutes Page 4 (Langseth's Pine Acres, IP87-26. Continued) MayoL WI ndsch it I then read JetteLs fOL the LecoLd fLom RichaLd Ray, 3358 174th Avenue and Ly]e Roesner, 17381 Poppy Street NW, both opposing the pLoJect. He stated the petition now stands at 16 yes, 5 no and 1 undecIded. Arnold Ahrens. 17440 MaLiaold - asked to change his vote to a no. Dave Saukola. 3301 174th Avenue - asked to change his vote to a no. It was determined ML. Oleson would have 2 no votes. With the changes, the petition Leads 14 yes, 8 no, and 1 undecided. Mr. Lanaseth - asked who absorbs the cost fOL the 2 units Lemoved fLom ML. Oleson's pLopeLty. Mayor Windschitl stated it is divided among the remaining assessable units. M.. Lanaseth - stated he hoJds many of the Jots, and he would Jlke to have a second chance to vote if the bids come back higheL. MayoL WindschitJ stated the policy is the heaLing is Lecal led if theLe is a 5 percent dlffeLence between the bid pLice and the estimated cost. M.. Lanaseth - stated he owns the holding pond lot, which is unbui I dabl e, which is being assessed $2,222. ~ - asked if the City would eveL mandate the tarLing of the Load If i t is not done now. MayoL Windschltl stated this Council and otheLs have not done that. The pLactice has been to act on petitions from the neighborhood fOL the localized Improvement. M.. Lanaseth - sympathizes with ML. Oleson. He can seJ]s his lots, bu t M.. O]eson is not in a position to divide up his faLm. He asked i f theLe Is a possibility of running blacktop on 174th Lane so Poppy wouldn't have to be affected. M.. Cook explained the costs to impLove Poppy in the futuLe PLobably would cost ML. Oleson more because of the segment that goes to 173Ld. MayoL Windschltl stated it is veLY difficult fOL maintenance to ]eave just one little stLeet. M.. Lanaseth - lIked the Idea of a cuI de sac on 174th to keep the tLaffic down, aSking I f that couJd be consideLed. Councilman OLttel though t theLe mal' be mOLe abuse of the paLk with a cuI de sac wi th people going in at night, etc. Also, people tend to squeal theiL car tiLes aLound cui de sacs. Plus a cuI de sac wou]d not lessen the costs of the pLoJect. The numbeL of assessable units would be less, and each unit would end up paying more. M.. O]eson - stated his pLopeLty is not in GLeen ACLes but he is actively farming It. It Is a lot of monel' fOL him and Is something he can get along without it. -- PubJ Ic HeaLlngs FebruaLY 18, 1988 - Minutes Page 5 (Langseth's Pine ACLes, IP87-26, Continued) Ms. Kina - stated this Is a laLge amount of monel', and she would not want to be assessed extLa fOL a cuI de sac. ML. Lanaseth - stated his wife pLefeLs blacktop stLeets, but he also undeLstands Mr. Oleson's position. He's fOL letting this dLop until theLe aLe mOLe people to pal' for it. ....:L - didn't feel the pLoJect would get any cheapeL and was tiLed of dLiving in mud. ML. Lanaseth - asked if he wouJd be assessed fOL the holding pond, Lot 1 off Round Lake BoulevaLd. That lot was set aside fOL the pondi ng when It was developed. He said he'd give i t to the City as a holding pond. Counc i I debated whetheL the lot would be assessed to the City i f the City took i t fOL dLainage pULposes. It was agreed to addLess that issue when final plans and specifications aLe done. MOTION by Apel, Seconded by EI ling, a Resolution ordering the Improvement of stLeet construction, PLoJect No. 87-26 in the Langseth's area and diLecting pLeparation of final plans and specifications. (See ResolutIon R027-88) DISCUSSION: MayoL Windschltl explained the proJect wi I I proceed as presented wIth the exception that ML. Oleson would be assessed 4 units in the pLoJect. The EngineeLs wi I I look at the dLainage question and seeded shoulders. Motion carLied unanimously. Public HeaLing fOL Langseth's Pine ACLes was closed at 8:55 p.m. HAWK RIDGE/IP87-23 M.. Cook reviewed the proposed stLeet impLovement pLoJect fOL Hawk Ridge at an estimated cost of $211,680, and an estimated cost of $5,428 for each of the 39 uni ts in the pLoject. Tesitmony was then opened to the Lesidents. JudY ? 177th - asked the pLocess i f the cost is mOLe than the . estimate, how the costs are aLLived at, and who bids fOL the pLoJect. The EnglneeLs explained the process of doing a feasibi lit I' study to estimate the costs, doing plans and specs and adveLtising fOL bids in a numbeL of papeLS. If the bids Lun 5 peLcent over the estimate, the Council po Ii cy has been to Lecall the public heaLing. Paul Sherman. 2600 179th Avenue NW - signed a petition against the Load. He asked why they are wanting to pave the Load. Counc II noted the petitIon was generated by his nelghboLs, not the City. Public HeaLings February 18, 1988 - Minutes Page 6 (Hawk Rldge/IP87-23, Continued) LesteL Vanhouten - voted yes because of the dirt. But he was told it would cost about $3,000 peL lot. He has now signed a petition against, and he pLesented a petition to the Council with signatuLes opposing the pLoJect. JerLv Br ¡ sto I . 17801 Zion Street - original II' bLought the petition aLound. Even though i t is a lot of monel', he would still like the proJect to go in. He's lived theLe eight years and is tiLed of the dust in the summer. He undeLstands the feeJ ing of those not wanting to pay the $5,500 for the road but hoped they will now have mOLe respect for the neighboLs and dLive mOLe slowly when the Loads aLe dLY. Steve WiatLak. 2740 179th Avenue - dLives a conveLtibJe, and he's had people pass him and bULl' him in dust. He's tiLed of it. He also stated equal PLopeLty with paved streets wi I I sell fasteL and at $5,000 mOLe than those on diLt stLeets. He stated he lives in the middle of the aLea and wouldn't mind It eitheL i f It wasn't fOL the dust in the house OL the inability to open windows. Nick Haupt. 180th and ArLowhead - asked the proposal and time frame fOL natuLal gas and city seweL and water. MayoL Windschitl explained the inability of the City to bLing seweL and wateL to that area and noted the natuLal gas is a function of the gas company. M.. SchLantz also explained If natuLal gas should come through, it would be pJaced in the boulevards. It was determined the petition received this evening had 24 opposing the pLoJect out of the 39 lots in the aLea, which is oveL 50 peLcent. In a show of hands fLom those in the audience, 17 weLe opposed, 2 weLe in favoL. MOTION by Orttel, Seconded by Apel, that we haJt consideLation of stLeet impLovement fOL the Hawk Ridge Addition aLea. (See Reso 1 uti on R028-88) DI SCUSSI ON: MayoL Windschitl explained no fULtheL action would be taken LegaLding stLeet construction in theiL aLea unless anotheL petition is Leceived with signatures fLom over 35 peLcent of the land aLea. Motion carLied unanimousJy. The hearing was closed at 9:10 p.m. BLUEBIRD/YELLOW PINE. WARD LAKE DRIVE/IP88-2 MayoL Windschitl explained the City Council was committed MSA funds to building WaLd Lake DLlve this year trom Hanson Boulevard east and aLound the corner to the last Jot in Audette's Addition I f the City can get the right of way thLough theLe. PubJ ic Hearings February 18, 1988 - Minutes Page 7 (Ward Lake DLlve, IP88-2, Continued) Kathleen MIller. 1519 Ward Lake DrIve - asked If they would lose any tLees. MayoL WlndschitJ explained a ceLtain I ine of sight is needed on any road pLoJect fOL safety; howeveL. the Intent would be to save as many tLees as possible. Michael Kina. 17714 Yel lOW Pine Street - stated they do not want to lose the oaks tLees, wondeLlng how faL the Load would go. He understood the pLesent Jocation is not wheLe i t is supposed to be. M.. Cook showed an oveLhead of the pLoposed Load alignment and tLees that would be affected by the project. The intent is to place the Load to the south. LaLrv Audette - stated Manley Magnuson called him today fLom FloLida to state he is in favoL of the pLoJect and wouJd be willing to dedicate the easement. within reason. Also, the overhead shows Ward Lake DLive as a stLaight Load, but it is not that stLaight. MayoL Windschitl explained the condemnation and assessment pLocedure that would be LequiLed fOL the entiLe pLoject if someone wouJd not be willing to dedicate the necessaLY easement so everyone would be treated equally. ML. Cook Leviewed the proposed aJlgnment and Light of way I ines as i t affects the pLopeLties along the Load and the trees and brush that wi II need to be removed. The poweL poJes wilJ stay on the south side of the Load. ApPLoxlmatelY the nOLth 10 feet of Light of way wi 1 J not be cleared. He aJso stated paLt of the investigation wi I I be to look at the drainage area, but I t wi II basicalJy go where I t does today. The street section will be concrete cULb and gut teL, and no paLklng wi] I be allowed. M.. Cook also stated the fence neaL the corner wi I I be in the Light of way. but he did not think I t wi II need to be moved. Mayor Windschitl stated AEC has not been Leceptive to bULyIng poweL lines. So in all I ikel ihood, the poweL I ines wi II not be bULied with this pLoJect eitheL. M.. SchLantz also explained the COLneL by Audette's Addition wi I I be mOLe of aT-type intersection, probably with a stop sign. MayoL Windschltl then explained the pLocedure fOL determining the speed I iml t on the Load, thinking the State would set the speed at 45 to 50 mph. though they have tended not to change existing posting. He also felt the blacktop Load would incLease the safety factoL. Mayor Windschitl asked if anyone would Lefuse to give the easements along the pLoJect. The City would like to get this pLoJect out fiLst. Dennis FJaata - asked how many tLees would have to be taken out. The pLopeLty is staked about 10 feet up into the trees, and he didn't want to see them removed. ML. SchLantz explained the City would need Publ ic Hearings February 18, 1988 - Minutes Page 8 (Ward Lake Drive, IP88-2, Continued) 10 feet of his property, but the that 10 feet would not be clear cut. From the overhead drawing, it appears the road wouJd be out of the trees along his lot. The proposaJ is to take 50 feet south of the section line and 10 feet north of It. Larrv Audette - stated he had the property surveyed years ago, and he actually owns 16 feet into Mr. Flaata,s property. He always wanted the trees for a wind break, but he would prefer to have the improved road. He understood there are only one or two trees in the way, and there is a cluster of trees in his yard that wlJl have to go. M.. Cook stated there about three large trees that wi II be affected from Bluebird to Yellow Pine Street. Counc i I directed the Engineers to stake the road so the residents know where the right of way will be located and to tag the trees that will need to be cut. MOTION by EJ ling, Seconded by Knight, a Resolution ordering the improvement of street construction, ProJect No. 88-2 in the Ward Lake Drive area and directing preparation of final plans and specifications. (See Resolution R029-88) Motion carried unanimously. M.. Cook then reviewed the proposed Improvement of Yel low Pine Street, noting the cost per lot is estimated at $3,540. He anticipated a mid-Mal' start i f i t is approved this evening. M.. Schrantz explained the top soi J and seeding can be brought up to the blacktop instead of a grave] shoulder i f the residents prefer. Phi I HaQbera. 17817 Yellow Pine - didn't want to pave Yellow Pine for a long driveway if Ward Lake Drive Is not done for some reason. He is in favor of the improvement but not If it ties into a dirt road. The Counc i I noted the previous motion is a commitment to construct Ward Lake Drive. If the easements are not donated, it would delay the proJ ect; but the City would proceed with the condemnation procedure. Everyone present indicated approval of the proposa I . MOTION by EJling, Seconded by Knight, a resolution ordering the improvement of street construction, ProJect No. 88-2 in the YelJow Pine Street area and directing preparation of final plans and specifications. (See Resolution R030-88) Motion carried unanimously. M.. Cook then reviewed the proposed Improvement for Bluebird Street for an estimated cost of $69,741, $4,360 for each of the 16 units. Construction would be scheduled with Ward Lake Drive and Yellow Pine. M.. Schrantz explained the public hearing wouJd be recal led if the bids come In 5 percent over the engineer's estimates. It was fel t i t would be a 30 mph street. PubJic Hearings February 18, 1988 - Minutes Page 9 (Bluebird Street, IP88-2, Continued) One woman was concerned about the traffic after it is paved, thinking it wi J J become an avenue for speeding drivers and sod trucks. Tom Moonev. 17744 Bluebird - asked why BJuebird wouldn't quaJify for State Ald. Mayor Windschitl explained the requirements of State Aid streets, noting BJuebird will not quaJ i fl'. In discussing the drainage, Mr. Cook noted there is a problem in the bend, but at this time he didn't know what the soJution wouJd be. That wi II be addressed at the time of the design. Mayor Windschitl read letters Into the record from Mr. and Mrs. Richard BJock, 17947 Bluebird, opposing the proJect, and from Gary and Swanetta Gulden, 17916 Bluebird, in favor of the proJect. M.. Schrantz stated the City does not have a petition from this year. M.. Lee - changed his vote from no to yes. -1- - stated there are a lot of sod trucks using their road, asking i f they wi I J be restricted because of weight once i t is paved. Counc i I stated the City can restrict it and should. I t wi II be a 7-ton city street, and sod trucks should not be on it. Don Carlson. 18047 Bluebird - asked about the berm and the thickness of the road. Mayor Wlndschitl described the bituminous shoe curb. The road mat wi J] be 2 inches, which holds up very weJI in residential areas. The goal is to get the sod trucks to use Hanson BouJevard. -1- - asked if there is an abiJity to pal' off the assessment. Mayor Windschitl stated yes, though the time of year it is paid off wi II affect the amount of Interest owed. M.. Carlson - asked to change his yes vote to a no. Bettv Packer. 17879 Bluebird - questioned how a decision could be made when only two have written and only six residents are present. And she though t the original petition was not indicating whether or not they wanted the road but whether or not a study shou]d be done to determIne how much it will cost. She was concerned that a decision wi J J be made on the votes of only half the residents. Mayor WindschitJ stated the assumption is those who signed the originaJ petition would either have conveyed a change of position in writing or this evening. Mr. Schrantz stated the notice of hearing indicated everyone could sign a petition either for or against the proJect. In a show of hands, 3 residents were in favor, 3 were opposed. Wi th the written letters, the vote is 4 in favor, 4 opposed, totalling only half the benefitted lots. Pub] ic Hearings February 18, 1988 - Minutes Page 10 (Bluebird/IP88-2, Continued) In looking at the origina] petition and the changes made this evening, the Counc i ] determined the vote was 7 yes, 4 no and 5 undecided. Severa] residents again argued that was yes to a feasibility study, not necessarily to the proJect itself. Severa] on the Counc il were a]so uncomfortable making a decision without having a c]ear indication of what the residents want. Discussion was on whether to act on the proJect thIs evening. MOTION by Ape], Seconded by Knight, to drop the idea of improving the street constructIon for BJueblrd Street because of what would appear to be a lack of interest in having it done by the people who live in that area. DISCUSSION: Residents asked if more grave I could be put on the road and how often the road will be graded. M.. Schrantz stated the road wil I be graded on the same frequency as it has always been. The City's po]icy has been not to add gravel to residential streets, but to improve the bad streets to blacktop. After further discussion, It was then agreed to ho]d the public hearing open to the March 1 regu]ar meeting to allow time for further input or petitions from the residents along Bluebird. Councilmen Knight and Ape] WITHDREW the Second and the Motion. MOTION by Elling, Seconded by Knight, to continue this to the next regu I ar Counc I I meeting; at that time we wi J 1 decide yes or no. Motion carried unanimously. MOTION by EI ling, Seconded by Apel, to continue the public hearing to the next regular Council Meeting. Motion carried unanimously. Hearing continued to March 1 , 1988. 10:33 p.m. RespectfulJy submitted, "{\ - ~L f' -'- ~' ,U.., c l'í::;c~ ~ Ma cella A. Peach Reco ding Secretary