HomeMy WebLinkAboutPH June 12, 1975
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Cfry of ANDOVER
PUBLIC HEARING - JUNE 12, 1975
MINUTES
Pursuant to notice published thereof, a Public Hearing on Proposed Storm Sewer
and Street Im~rovement in Auditor's Subdivision No. 82, was called to order by
Andover City Mayor, Richard J. Schneider, June 12, 1975, 7:35 P. M., at the
Andover comtunity Center, 1685 Crosstown Boulevard N. W., Anoka, Minnesota.
Councilpersons present: Rither, VanderLaan, Windschitl
Councilpersonb absent : Holasek, (Arrived 7:55 p. M. )
Also present: City Engineer, D. R. Kasma; City Attorney, Wm. Hawkins;
City Building Official, Walter Arntzen; City Clerk,
Pat Lindquist; Reporter, Shirley Hatfield; and approximately
75 residents.
er briefly outlined events leading up to the ordering of the Public
City Council at the May 6, 1975 Meeting.
The Hearing as then turned over to City Engineer, D.R. Kasma. Mr. Kasma
read a letter to a suburban City Council from an attorney, regarding "Storm
Drainage" ( ibit "A" attached). A letter dated June 12 from T.K.D.A., sent
to the residen s with the Notice of Hearing, was read and thoroughly explained by
Mr. Kasma ( xhibit "B" attached). It was noted by the engineer that an assessment
policy had not been adopted by the City Council, however, this would be done
very soon. H explained that in the case of blacktopped streets, the City guarantees
the upkeep on them, and that the residents cannot be re-assessed for at least the
length of time on the bonds, whether it be 10 or 15 years; and that a re sident can
only be as ses ed once for storm sewer.
Residents we e invited to present quèstions and statements. Said testimony as
follows. (Sta f responses shown in parentheses. )
G. s - 3629 l43rd Avenue N. W.
ormed the Council that a survey had been taken in the area and that
th results would be explained and given to the City Council by another
r sident. Stated that in daily jogging throughout the area, he had never
n ticed any severe ponding on any of the streets in the subdivision.
S ggested that a pipe be run straight back from Castle's place into
R und Lake.
(Dewey asma - The suggestion is fine, but the water would "eat up" the
blacktop f the road were graded down to allow the water to run this way; it
could be one if the roads were gra.vel and deep ditches were made to allow
for the p oper drainage. )
Steven R kkili - 3720 - l43rd Avenue N. W.
r,resented petitions covering the residents' opinions on ¡)Storm Sewer
nd 2) Blacktop Streets, and indicated the results as follows:
Storm Sewer - 52 opposed, 2 favored, and 2 with no opinion.
Blacktop - 47 opposed, 9 favored, and 2 with no opinion.
"'bli. H...in, f Juno 12, l?75
Minutes - Page 2
Resident Testimony (Continued)
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Art Speaker - 14346 Woodbine Street N. W.
Asked if any effort had been made to see if Federal Loans would be
ivailable for this project.
(Dewey K sma - None is available for storm sewers or street projects, unless
one WOUldl go to a 30-year loan-but then the interest could be prohibitive for
a project his size.)
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Questioned the engineer on whether or not the blade could ruin the
9urb while plowing; and asked why a definite figure could not be
~iven before the project is ordered, and what would happen if the
bid price escalated considerably over the estimate.
(Dewey KÅsma - 32 feet are plenty wide for a street, so the blade should have
plenty of foom; and the estimates are pretty accurate, and if the bids do come
in extremely high as compared to the estimate, the Council could refuse to
accept thim. )
sked if the improvement would cause the taxes to go up; and if
1nyone had spoken to his real estate agent advising him that the
ity of Andover was going to correct the water problem.
(Dewey K sma - Property values do increase somewhat with any improvement,
however, not to any great extent. )
LeRoy NO,rdstrom - 3737 - l44th Avenue N. W.
tated that he could not afford an increase in taxes c,aused by the
ssessment, and wanted to know why something was being done that
ould have to be taken up in 4 to 5 years when sewer and water were
ut in the area; everything should be done at the same time.
(Dewey K sma - The sewer could be 15 to 20 years away; improvements are
as case 0 investing money, not losing it. )
sked if a 1 1/2" bituminous surface would be enough to stand up under
traffic. Also noted that only two persons were having the bulk of the
ater problems, and it was the developer's fault, therefore the other
eople should not have to pay for it.
(Dewey K sma - 1 1/2 " of bituminous is sufficient for the amount of traffic
in that ar a. Only those persons benefiting from the storm sewer will be
assessed or same. )
Ann Gallus - 14278 Underclift Street
Åsked Mr. Kasma if he had personally viewed the area; and noted
t at she had never seen a pond in the area south of l43rd.
(Dewey K sma - Yes, I have gone' over the area; and if those residents
south of 1 43rd have no problem, this area could be removed from the project.)
Mike Yeh e - 3648 - l43rd Avenue N. W.
tated that he lives in the area in question, and has never had a proble m_
oth his ya,rd and the street are and have been dry after the last two days
f heavy rain. Asked why he had not received a Public Hearing Notice.
- Public Hearin~ - June 12, 1 ';J75
Minutes - Pag 3
(Pat Lind uist - The Anoka County Treasurer's Office only shows plat and
parcel number, name and address of person or corporation receiving tax
statementl If the tax statement goes to the lending institution, only the
owner's n~me is listed; we used section maps, phone books and assessment
books to lbcate owner's address--<tnd if none could be found, the notice was
sent, as i~ your case, to Twin City Federal. )
Åsked if the project had to be done if no-one in the area had problems.
(Dewey KÅsma - If the street project were approved, then the storm sewer would
go in as planned, if not, parts of the storm sewer could be left out. If the
southern part were dropped from the storm sewer project, the cost would
drop to approximately $37,000.00, but it is to be remembered that there would
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also be less property owners to pay the assessment. )
Rosella slnstebY - 4100 7th Avenu'; N. W.
_iuggested running the storm sewer from l44th to Xenia, then south
nd making a pond in the low area of Govt. Lot 2; and noted that the
kids could use this pond for skating during the winter months.
(Dewey Krsma - This is not a permanent solution, and ditches can cause
additiona problems. The question also comes up on who is to pay for the project
if the siz of the project is reduced too much. )
Iso asked why the Public Hearing Notice included some areas that
ould receive no benefit.
(William Hawkins - The Public Hearing Notice covers the largest potential
area that could conceivably be assessed. )
John Lof trom - 3608 - 144th Avenue N. W.
tated that when the question of storm sewer was discus sed first
ver a year ago, the residents were told that it could not go into
ound Lake because of the water table.
(Dewey K sma - We have shot the elevation and it will work. We will be
taking ou over 10,000 yards of dirt v.hen we grade down the roads. )
uggested grading down now, so the water would have a place to go.
(Dewey K sma - IT we did that before blacktopping, the water would sit in the
road.)
John Ber y - 3755 - l43rd Avenue N. W.
tated that he did not think that 1 1/2" of blacktop was sufficient.
everal firms had told him that 2" would be the minimum. Asked
hat would be the cheapest way to go on the project.
(Dewey sma - Another 1/2" would cost approximately another $1. 00 per
foot. Wi h a sand base, there would be no heaving or buckling, therefore,
1 1/2" s ould be sufficient. The only cheaper way to go would be to eliminate
the area outh of l43rd, and go to a 20' roadway. )
sked why there was a catch basin proposed in front of his house.
(Dewey sma - These are needed for the total area for total blacktopping,
as the £r nt ditch would be filled. You would not be included unless the
blacktop~ing is done. )
Public Hearing June 12, í. :;
'Minutes - Page
Larry Morris - 3605 - l43rd Avenue N. W.
Stated that only six families are having problems, therefore, the
1ity should forget the roads and go the cheapest way possible.
Charles Wood strom _ 3701 - l45th Avenue N. W.
j,sked i,f the property along the lake was going to be assessed for
t e proJect.
(Dewey Kisma - Ndhing north of l45th Avenue will be assessed. )
John MelJe - 14211 Vintage Street N. W.
Asked if the entire area had been shot for elevation; and if everyone
*ould be assessed. Also wanted to know what would keep the water
lut of his front yard.'
(Dewey K sma - The entire area has been shot for elevation; and only the
benefited Iproperty owners will be assessed ;':md the water should be kept
out of yoJr front yard by cutting down the street. The council has up to
six montHs to revise the project area. )
Dan sChJist - 14319 Underclift Street N. W.
Eated that the streets were not a problem, and $1,000.00 was too
uch to spend for an inconvenience; and if the storm sewer was
bsolutely necessary, then he would like to go ahead with it now.
fkod C_oil"","un Wind"biH whu..d wba, h. wu. ..'ming ,.
hen he had mentioned in a conversation that there was litigation
ending against the builder .)f some of the homes having problems.
(Council erson Windschitl - A civil suit had been instigated against E. V. Builders
by Messr1s. Bronstad.. and Leuck. )
Asked if the plaintiffs would receive a cash settlement if they won the
ase; and stated that if this did happen, it would not be fair.)
(Willi:am awkins - Regardless of the decision, the plaintiffs would still be
assessed he same as everyone, else.)
Jerry Br nstad - 14338 Woodbine Street N. W.
r,.d 'bal h. wuwd nul b. mukin, uny mon.y hum lb. luw,w' u,uin.,
. V. Builders.
Steve Lib r - 14279 Underclift Street N. W.
Asked if he would be assessed for his whole lot if only part of it were
enefited as shown on the map; and if he could be assessed again for
torm sewer.
(Dewey K sma - The assessment would only be for the square footage of the
of the lot if another line were put in to benefit that part of the area. ) ,
Pat Horn r - 14269 Woodbine Street N. W.
tSked if there would be a public hearing when and if sanitary sewer
I ere ever proposed for the area.
(Mayor Schneider - Yes, and the residents would be notified. )
Public Hearing Tune 12, 1. J
Minutes _ Page
Martin Castle - 14339 Vintage Street N. W.
sked if the street could just be cut down and the water run directly
i to Round Lake.
(Dewey Ka ma - If the grade were.reversed, this could just transfer the problem
to another area. )
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Mayor Sc neider asked Mr. Kasma if st-e-rm sewer would be needed if sanitary
sewer weie Pc~Li~; and if the installation of S~h sewer at a later date would
disturb th bfâ:-cktop. Mr. Kasma noted that storm sewer definitely would be
needed.~~ot di3LurL the ol<t~1CluP; <rnd-he-<i~!u'l ",ùvu~äL" ùuing
<he .'''''[ b,foo, "tilili.., lilb, uHliti.. ... immiuo"t 'n lb, my no" £utu.,_
but sanita y sewer looks quite a way into the future for this area.
Larry Sto y - 14338 Vintage Street N. W.
:"tsked how the assessment would be gauged for payment; and noted that
J has water in his backyard that is coming from down the street.
(Dewey K sma _ Everyone who benefits pays equally; if you feel you are
assessed nfairly, you can handle this at the assessment hearings before
certificatfn, at which time each question will be checked out so that the
assessme t will be fair.)
Ron Johns,on - 14416 Vintage Street N. W.
~oted that he felt that if the project would shrink too much, it could
e put through because there would not be as many people objecting.
Councilpe son Rither - The engineer had checked for the cheapest solution to
the probl m which was $13,700.00. If it were done this way, the cost would
have to b borne by the General Fund; and the General Fund just could not
afford su h a cost.
Councilpe son VanderLaan - IT this were done on one project, a precedent
would be stablished, and it would have to be done this way on all future projects.
It would s ill be coming out of your taxes, and in the end, could cost everyone
more.
Walter A ntzen - If Mr. Castle were to do the work to solve his own problem,
it could c st him upwards of $3,000.00; and if he did go ahead and do this, it
would cre te the same type of problem for his neighbors. Mr. Castle's sewer
has failed now, and if something is not done, I would gues s that three more
will fail ithin the next six months.
Councilpe son Holasek - The water problem has to be resolved; but I feel
that with he pos sibility of sanitary sewer coming in the near future, you would
not get th useful life out of the blacktopping before it was torn up.
Councilpe son Windschitl to Mrs. Sonsteby - Do you Own the property to the west,
and is thi not a peat area? What would happen if you ran the line down into this
area inst~ad of Round Lak~, as it is a shor~er distance? Mrs. Sonsteby replied
that she d d own the area, It was peat, and it would be a good idea to run it into
lbi. ....I"d m.k, · .kuHog oink '00 lb, kid, in lb, wiole., huw'm, lbi, wuuld
F'ublic Hearing me 12, l7,J
Minutes _ Page 6
be aolittli south of 143rd (Councilperson Windschitl had referred to the area
straight est of l44th and Xenia); and that this would be a good temporary
solution until everything has to go in. Councilperson Windschitl emphasized
that it wo~ld have to be a permanent solution.
councilPJrson VanderLaan to Mr. Kasma - Would taking off pieces of the
project b detrimental tocother property owners; and would it be just another
temporar solution? Mr. Kasma replied that the pipes would be sized so
that addit onal lines could be tied in; and would be permanent in each stage.
The audience co mented on the City's allowing these homes to be built in an area
where drainage problems were anticipated. The Council noted that there are standards
in existence nowl which were not at that time, that will not permit this to occur.
Discussion with e engineer on cost figures if the project were reduced in size,
or if specific ite s were removed from the project.
MOTION by Vand rLaan, seconded by Windschitl, that the Public Hearing on the
proposed Storm ewer and Street Surfacing in Auditor's Subdivision No. 82, be
continued to Jun 18, 1975, 7:30 P. M., at the Andover Community Center,
1685 Crosstown oulevard N. W., Anoka, Minnesota. Engineer Kasma asked for
diuodiun '<om ~ cu..on .. <0 who' fig"m und b_d..i.. lb.y w.n,.d foo lb.
continued hearin , and was informed those for the area north of l43rd Avenue.
Motion carried animously.
Hearing adjourn d at 9:25 P.M., June 12, 1975, to be continued on June 18, 1975,
7:30 P.M.
Patricia K. Lind uist
Clerk/Treasure
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MEMORANDUM TO FOREST LAKE VILLAGE COUNCIL
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RE: STORM DRAINAGE
No municipal improvement causes greater discussion from both
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property owners and elected officials than stonn drainage. Some property
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owners, especially ones with no particular drainage problems, take the
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position that there is no private benefit to their property by installation I'
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of storm drainage.
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In view of the confusion on this situation, we, will attempt to
outline ~lOW some of the reasons the Courts have given justifying pri"ðte
"'''''fi'11'''''''dual p<o_ """"" &om I."allan"" of """" dunlna90,
-, even though a Rarticular ~arcel situated on hiqh land is already weU
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1. DISCF.ARGE OF THE RESPONSIBILITY FOR INCREASED
UNOFF. Before a particular property Is improved I only about
: t n per cent (10%) of the water that faUs on such property runs
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ff to neighboring land. The other ninety per cent (90~) is
oaked into the soil, held back in natural depressions or ¡
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vaporatød.
The act of improving tþe property, however, eliminates
he very features that tended to hold back and absorb the water.
....... Factors such a8 construction of a street, grading the
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- rroperty, constructing buildings, improvements and driveways,
result In an increased runoff so that after improvement
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approximately forty-five per cent (45%) of the water runs off
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on to neighboring land and becomes, according to common law
bonc6Pt. "outlaw water", a responsibility of the individual
roperty owner.
Construction of stonn drainage helps the individual
roper-ty owner dIscharge such responsibility and is, therefore.
direct benefit.
2. DISPOSAL OF WASTE PRODUCT. Another theory partly
elated to the above, is that amounts of stonn water in greater
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antities than can be used and absorbed by the so11 result in
noff of a waste product on to neighboring lands just as much
s the dl.scharge of sewage or garbage. If the construction of
torm drainage is the best disposal of this waste product, then
direct benefit results to the property owner in discharging his
OOi vidual re sponsib1Uty.
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3. PERMITTING FASTER RUNOFF. In many villages the
rea proposed to be served by a storm drainage is fairly level
As surface water forms its own barrier, the drawing
ff of such surface water on lower levels is made possible by
storm drainage and therefore allows water on upper land to flow
ore readily and escape faster.
Page No.2.
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4. INCREASED MARKET VALliE. It is generally accepted
t t the market value of a particular neighborhood, and
therefore the market value of each parcel of land located
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within the neighborhood, is increased due to adequate storm
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water drainage.
5. BETTER ACCESS. By eliminating accumulations of
surface water, access to property is often improved in Umes
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of wet conditions.
L""" "'œfit ""'" "ann "'''n.,." thal ...qu." "~d'.I~..
would slrve to prevent all or a substantial portion of serious damage which
might 0 cur throughout a whole neighborhood in the event of an unpredictable
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flood of rain water or melting snow.
t has been held to be a benefit to the public health to dispose of
surface ate!' which, .If left standing, would be a breeding ground for
insects and other forms of growth inJurious to the public health.
he ge,neral public also derives benefit from storm drainage in that
storm d ainage makes possible street improvements and provides drainage
for stre ts, which drainage reduces the cost of future maintenance.
hat l"::Jrtion of storm drainage assessed against property owners
is usua lV assessed on an area square foot basis, although other methods
- could b employed. In the case of this particular improvement, the
Page No.3.
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Village must assess at least twenty per cent (20%) of the cost ot the
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improvement, The exact amount of assessment, and method of
assessmentJcannot be determined, however, until after the total project
costs have en calculated and the Councll has determined the amount of
general benelit to be paid by the Village as a whole. ,
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Village Attorney I
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Page No.4. I
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TKDA I
TOm, KING, DUVALL,ANDERSON AND ASSOCIATES INCORPORATED i
I!:NGINI!:I!:RS AND ARCHITI!:CTS
1408 PIONEER BUILDING
SAINT PAUL, MINNESOTA
55101 224 -7891
f RICHARD M. IBARKER ¡
June 12, 1975 OWEN J. BEATTY
D,,'UUL lot. BERKOWITZ
ROBERT J¡.. 80YE"
JAMES C. BROTEN
ARNDT J. DUVALL
HUGO O. EftICK&ON
WILLIAM J. "IYDr...
~OYC! e. HANSEN
STEPHEN M. HARTLEY
CLI""ORO E. JOHNSON
CUWAYNE R. KASMA
J. THOMA.S KIRK
DAVID W. I<IRKWOLD
A. DIAN LUNDHOLM
FtoaERT T. MALONEV "
.tJCHAftO D. MENKEN "
LEONARa ca. MIL.LER
WAYNE A.. OLSON
DUANE T. PREW
R;UCOL.PH p, RAITOA
fll:OBItRT R. RYDER
WILLIAM T. SHERIDAN
ABE J, SPERL.INQ
ARNOLD M. STEFrr'!8
WALTER W. THORPE
JAMES E, VOVEN
NATHAN P. WEBER
Dear Resident: GEORGE J. IiCHROEPFEft
CLIFFORD W. HAMBLIN
The City Council i conducting a Public Hearing on June 12, 1975 at 7:30 P.M.
) discus s the feasibility of constructing storm sewers and bituminous surfaced
streets in Auditor1s Sub-division No. 82, City of Andover.
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Th. folluwing ,nfUFuliun i' p'...n"" un <b. p......d p"j'''' ,
1) Why is a s orm sewer system necessary?
The probleL of strom water runoff must be faced in every area which
""d"'''J d...lupn"n' in" h="lI", Poi", 'u d,..lup~"" ,""".
runoff pre ents few problems. But as growth occurs. the surface topo-
graphy is hanged and natural drainage ways are altered or blocked. Drive-
ways, str ets, the roofs of buildings and other man made structures in-
crease th intensity and amount of runoff. Rain fall which may have evap-
orated or oaked away previously now runs off and settles in localized areas.
High lots, on which most rain fall and snow melt was caught in the rougher,
undcvelop d land, are now smoothly graded. Runoff is therefore increased
causing m re problems for low lots.
The propo ed storm sewer system would drain the water which collects in
these loca ized low points. The point of origin of this water is not only the
low lots. ut all property which drains into a particular drainage basin.
TIll' atla'" t'cI Flgnrt" No. I shows the location of lhl' proposl'cI storm s"W('r
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HYAtt'nl, a cI the bcnditrc1 area,
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~'me 12, 1975 I
age Two
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2) What type of street construction is proposed for our area? ì
A street prlject in your area would include excavating the existing dirt I
roads to prÒvide proper street profiles and drainage, placing a 32 foot
wide by 4" thiCk gravel street base, and constructing a 32 foot wide
,1-1/2" thic bituminous driving surfacing with bituminous gutter. !
T he life exJectency of the street, with prope r sealcoating and cJ:'ack- I
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filling, is 10 to 20 years. I
The attachjd Figure No. Z shows the streets which are proposed to be I
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constructej' ,
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3) What is the proposed time schedule of the Citv to install central sanitary I
sewer and watermain systems in this area?
Th, ...o.¡ ^.,Hloo'. Sub-dl.i.iuo Nu. gz .. wilbin lb. U.boo Plooolo, Au..
of the City as shown in the Comprehensive Plan. Extension of the sanitary I
sewer syst m to this area is planned as development OCcurs and as service I
i, "qu..t by p.."".ly ~n..., !
It is diffic It to predict the exact time of thts extension since a wide range
of economic factors influence development. We estimate that 5 to 10 years
may pass ~efore sewer service is extended to this area. The actual date I
may, of course, vary considerably from these time estimates. ,
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Constructi n of a water system to Serve this area is not being planned at this
time. Th earliest date for water service extenUon would be when sanitary
ice is extended, but, as previously stated, no plans exist at this
is work.
4) What ste are neCessar et the work done?
T he following steps neces sary for the completion of the project:
A. City Council hold Public Hearing June 12, 1975
B. City Council orders project, authorizes
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Eng neer to prepare plans and specifications June 12, 1975 ,
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C. Eng neer submits plans for Council approval, i
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and receives authorization to advertise for bids July IS, 1975
D. Cit Council receives bids and awards contract August 5, 1975
E. Con ractor begins construction August II, 1975
F. Con ractor completes construction October I, 1975
G. Ci I Engineer prepares final cost estimates
and assessment roll October 1, 1975
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June 12, 1975 I
Page Three I
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H. City Council conducts assessmffi t hearing I
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Any errors or adjustments in asses sments are I
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made at this meeting October 14, 1975
I. Citl Council passes resolution accepting ì
ass ssment roll and directs Clerk to file with I
Ano a County Auditor before October IS, 1975 October 14, 1975 I
5) How much' will the storm sewer and street construction cost me?
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T he City Engineer has prepared cost estimates for construction of the
storm se1er system and the bituminous streets, These costs are as I
follows: I
St0'jm Sewer Construction $ 51,900.00 I
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Street Construction 108,700.00
Tot 1 Project Cost $ 160,600.00
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The entir cost of each of these improvements is proposed to be assessed I
against th bene fite d prope rtie s. Streets are assessed on an adjusted front
footage basis to all abutting properties. Adjusted front footages will include ,
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provision for corner lots and irregular shaped lots. !
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Based on he preliminary cost estimate of $108,700.00 and a total front footage
of 11,100 feet the front foot assessment for street would be $108,700 or $'.80
per front oot. ll,lOOFF
Storm se ers are assessed ona square footbasis. The boundaries of the drainage
area are ete rmined and each lot within those boundaries is assessed for each
square fo t of area d raining into the system. Based on the preliminary cost
estimate f $51, 900. 00 and a total benefited area of 1,230,000 square feet
the asses ment would be $ 51, 900. 00 or $.042 per square foot.
l,230,000SF
The assp sment for an average lot 100 feet in width by 150 feet deep,which
drains en irely into the storm sewer system would be as follows:
Str et Construction 100'.", $9.80 per foot = $ 980.00
Sto m Sewer Construction 15,000 SF x $.042 per SF 0, 620.00
$1600.00
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June l2, 1975 I
Page Four ,
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Assessment can be paid in full, or paid on an installment basis with ;
property taxes over a 10 or 15 year period. The annual charges, based
on a $1,600joo assessment and 8'}', annual interest, would be as follows:
Year 1 year assessment 15 year assessment
1976 288.00 234.66 i
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1977 275.20 226.08
1978 262.40 217.55 I
1979 249.60 209.02 i
1980 236.80 200.49
1981 224.00 191. 96 ,
1982 211.20 183.43 I
1083 198.40 174.90
1984 185.60 166.37
1085 172.80 157.84
1986 149.31 I
1987 140.78 ¡
1988 132.26
1989 123.73
1990 115.20
5) Wh ro"ect at this time?
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The constr ction industry prices have continued to rise in the past years, i
and the out! ok is for continued higher prices. The Engineering News
Record Cos Index, which is a national publication that indicates cost
trends in c nstruction, lists, the following increases in recent years based
01'$100.00 orth of construction in 1965:
Year Base of $100.00 Percent increases per ·year
1965 $ 100.00
1966 103.87 3.9 I
1967 108.90 4.8 ,
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1968 116. 07 6.6 i
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1969 127.64 10.0 I
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1970 136.60 7.0 I
1971 152.98 12.0 ,
1972 l73,74 13.6
1973 190.84 9.8
1974 202. 19 5.9
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June 12, 1975 I
Page Five i
If a project is need]d, it is reasonable to proceed with the project as soon as
possible to obtain the benefit of the improvement, since the interest at 80/r will
probably be less thin the annual increased construction cost.
As your City cons~ting Engineers, we hope this letter answers some of your
questions regardin this proposed street project.
Very truly yours,
TOLTZ, KING, DUVALL, ANDERSON
AND ASSOCIATES, INCORPORATED
~~~ i
DuWayne R. Kasma, P.E,
DRK:vlo !
"closure I
cc: Mrs. Pat Lindquist, Clerk-T reasurer I
Mr. WaIte Arntzen, Building Inspector
Andover Ci y Council I
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_ _ _ DENOTES æNEFITTED AREA PROPOSED STORM SEWER SYSTEM
0 DENOTES CATCH BASIN
11<DA AUDITORS SUB. NO. 82
CITY OF ANDOVER FIGURE I
""y ,., 1975
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STREEì CONSTRUCTION MAY 28, 1975 AUDITORS SUB, NO. 82
CITY OF ANDOVER FIGURE 2
I- PROPERTY LINE PROPERTY LlNE-1
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66' I
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tk a STANDARD SlØ.RBAN STREET
TOLTZ,KING,~ANDERSON SECTION
a ASSOCIATES, INC.
ENGINEERS I ARCHITECTS T 'MItI'IS,1975 OIIG. NO,' :3
ST. PAUL MINNESOTA
.
\
, , \2" \) STORM SEWER
~"
~-f RESIDENT OF AUDITOR'S SUB-DIVISION NO. 82, CITY OF ANDOVER:
I
RE: PUBLIC HEARING ON JUNE 12, 1975 at 7:30 P.M. -
ARE YOU IN FAVOR OF THE STORM SEWER SYSTEM AS PRESENTLY
I
PROPOSED BY THE CITY CONSULTING ENGINEERS?
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STREET CONSTRUCTION AND BITUMINOUS PAVING
RESIDENT OF AUDITOR'S SUB-DIVISION NO. 82, CITY OF ANDOVER:
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RE: PUBLIC HEARING ON JUNE 12, 1975at.7:30 P.M.
ARE YDU IN FAVOR OF THE STREET CONSTRUCTION AND BITUMINOUS PAVING
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AS PRESENTLY PROPOSED BY THE CITY CONSULTING ENGINEERS?
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STREET CONSTRUCTION MAY 28, 1975.
I CITY OF ANDOVER FIGURE 2
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, Cfry 01 ANDOVER
PUBLIC HEARING - JUNE 12, 1975
Pursuant to notice published thereof, a Public Hearing on Proposed Street Improvement
in the Russell (Stack) Addition, was called to order by Mayor, Richard J. Schneider,
June 12, 1975, 9:35 P. M., at the Andover Community Center, 1685 Crosstown Blvd. N. W.,
,
Anoka, Minnesota.
I Holasek, Rither, VanderLaan, Windschitl
Councilpersons present:
Councilpersons 'absent : None
Also present: City Engineer, D. R. Kasma; City Attorney, Wm. Hawkins;
City Building Official, Walter Arntzen; City Clerk,
Pat Lindquist; Reporter, Shirley Hatfield; and approximately
75 residents.
Mayor Schneider briefly outlined incidents and problems in the area which necessitated
,
the ordering of the Public Hearing by the City Council at their meeting on May 6, 1975.
I
TheI-':earing was then turned over the City Engineer, D. R. Kasma. Mr. Kasma noted
that 163rd Lane ¡had been left out unintentionally on the map sent to the residents with
the Public Hearing Notice. He informed the audience that the $3,000.00 already
contributed by r. Russell would cover approximately 1/2 mile" 20' wide, 3" thick
of Class #5; and that there are two miles of streets, not including l65th from 7th Avenue,
in Russell Addit on. A map was posted showing the front footage to be assessed on
each lot, should the project be approved. Mr. Kasma read and explained the letter
from T. K. D. A. sent to the residents with the Public Hearing Notice.
The Hearing wa then opened for questions and statements from the residents. Said
testimony as fol ows: (Staff responses shown in parentheses. )
Mike Gies e - 16604 Yakima Street N. W.
Asked¡ if the estimated $82,000.00 for bituminous surfacing covered seal
CUU'inf und who! wuuM hup",,' if d.ivowuy. du nul cum. un ü" wuy uU' 'U
the st eet. .
(Dewey Ka ma ~ Seal coating is done by the City out of the General Fund; the
maintenan e on a blacktopped street is minimal, so there is probably no more
money expended than on the grading and up-keep of a gravel road. We blacktop
to the pro erty line, and if there is, for instance, a ten foot gap, the property
owner will be asked if he would want the contractor to fill in é:nd pay the costs
himself. )
Asked Mr. Kasma what he recommended for the area; and noted that the
residJnts were very skeptical about assessment policy because they had
boo. fd 'u" "U muoh by lb. my uf Rum..y. H. olu'.d lbo! ol uno u'lb.
meeti gs with the Township of Ramsey prior to incorporation, a Ramsey
repre entative had stated, "why should we give them (Andover) any good
roads, they are not giving us any".
(Dewey Ka ma - Gravel is the minimum that I would recommend; and blacktop
,
is the way to go if you can afford it.)
(Council person Rither _ There was nothingïn writing, however, there is now
a written a1greement covering the payment of the $3,000 by Mr. Rus sell, and
the provision that the City of Ramsey will furnish the labor and material to
I
Public Hearing lne 12, L J
Minutes - Page L.
spread the gravel; and the subsequent ordering of the Public Hearing when it
was realiied that the $3,000 of Class #5 would not solve the problem. At one
meeting bètween the Cities of Andover and Ramsey, the Ramsey City Council
had noted that their plan for fixing these roads had they remained in their
City, was 'to do the work, and assess the costs back to the people.)
Linda Ruslell - 16805 Argon Street N. W.
Asked when the gas lines would be coming through, and if the roads
would have t" b:, torn up for this.
(Councilperson Windschitl - I have contacted the Gas Co., and as of noon today,
they stated that they would not be servicing your area in 1975. There present
policy is that they will not service any quarter section unless they have existing
pipe in the' ground-and the closest piping already in is 1 3/4 miles away from
,
your area (7th Avenue and Valley View). They stated that they will not disturb
the blacktop (will go down the boulevard, and if it is necessary to cross a street,
will go under).
Noted that a blacktopped street would encourage the people to drive
fister, which would make the streets more hazardous for children.
Glen Rogels - 16647 Manniteau Blvd. N.W.
Noted that a petition from the area residents had been given to the
G~s Co., and was on a priority list-iile #1376. Asked if the City
C~uncil had established a policy on seal coating.
I
(Mayor Schneider - no policy has been set, however, no-one has been charged
to date.) ~
A ked if the Council had looked into a way of solving the problem
wtthout Class #5 or blacktop. Noted that he had checked and found
t at it might be necessary to remove the clay before any blacktopping
c uld be done.
(Dewey Ka ma - Yes, and there is no other way. As far as removing the clay
before bla ktopping, this is done in some areas where the traffic is very heavy,
or in new evelopment areas-the ideal way is 6" of Class #3, 4" of Class #5,
and 1 1/2" of bituminous; but in this case we are looking at a minimum, not a
maximum, to solve the problem, and something that will last at least ten years,
as we ca~t re-assess for at least that period of time.)
N ted that the City did not have equipment and the staff to maintain
blacktopped streets. Asked what the interest rate is on the bonds;
a d the figures on the engineering fees for the project; and are these
fi ures included in the estimate.
(Dewey Ka ma - The interest rate is 7% now-normal policy is to charge an
additional % to cover administrative costs and for delinquent accounts.
The engine ring fees are approximately 9% for basic engineering. The estimate
sent to the residents includes an additional 15%; this includes engineering fees,
attorney's ees, other legal fees, and administration costs; and a 10'70 contingency
factor, plu the contractor's cost. If the bids come in much higher than the
estimate, the City Council has the option of refusing them. )
I
Public Hearing l June 12, 1975
1Jinutes _ FRge 3
Lloyd LaJy - 16627 Manniteau Street N. W.
Asked if just the bad spots could be fixed; and questioned the calculation
of assessable front footage on his lot.
(Dewey K¿sma - The $3,000 could be spread; however if this were not enough
to cover, there are and would be no additional monies available to purchase
the needed gravel-the City Council has taken the position that they will not
take monies from the general fund for improvement projects. If there is an
error in c~lculation of lot size and it will be figured again. )
Asked if there was a definite guarantee that the residents would not be
asses'sed for other improvement projects in the City on their general
taxes!
(Councilp~rson Windschitl _ It would be impossible to generate a tax levy
,
high enough to cover this type of project. )
(Councilperson Rither - While there is no definite policy, by virtue of action
taken by the Council on May 6, 1975, it was recognized in the resolution ordering
lb. "'bHJ Hwing ,"ul lbo Ci'y Cu..dl could nu' ",'lb."o CO"," Un lb. '0....1
levy. )
Ron Epso _ 16512 Zuni Street N. W.
Aske~ for a guarantee to the residents that if they were assessed for this
stree~ improvement, that no other street improvement in the City would go
on the general taxes.
(Dewey Kasma - The City Council has a proposed assessment policy in hand
to be adop ed. They have taken the position that an improvement project cannot
come out f general taxes _this is included in the proposal. )
Asked if 1 1/2" of bituminous was enough. Noted that he had lived in the
area ince 1969, and had never had any problem getting in or out until
recen ly; and contributed the cause being that the grader had pushed all
the existing gravel into the ditches.
(Dewey Ka1sma - 1 1/2" of bituminous matte allows for 50 heavy trucks per day.
Th. g.... will ,o! mixed in =d ;m.h.d mund, und in, uu 5 you.. i' muy b.
necesaary to re-do the roads in they are graveled now. )
Neil Powe 1 _ 16625 Argon Street N. W.
A.kO! huw =ny .ood" wm nul in u,"",'ubl. condiliun-fd' lbo' "% woo.
all ri ht. Noted that the grader was damaging the present roads.
J. J. Cho en - 16438 Argon Street N. W.
Noted that he had lived in the arffi for four years and had never had any
troubl on the roads.
Brad - Argon Street N. W.
ASkedtwhY the project cost had increased from $5500.00 in 1974 to
$32,0 0.00 now.
(Councilpe son Windschitl _ The $5500.00 covered only two streets - Yakima
and 166th Lane. )
Public Hearing ~ June 12, 1975
Minutes - Page '4
I
Edward Coleman - Attorney for Mr. C. Russell
Noted that Mr. Russell had given $3,000.00 per the Agreement, and now
as per the: engineer's estimate, it was going to cost him another $20,000.00 to
$25,000.00. Suggested a show of hands on what the residents wanted.
Mayor scJneider called for a show orhands on l)Blacktop, 2) Gravel,3)Use
Mr. Russell's $3,000 per the Agreement and fix the bad spots. Item #3
received a:nJ almost unanimous vote.
I
I
Clyde Russell - 16518 Roanoke Street N. W.
Suggested that he and the engineers go over the roads and find the bad
spots 'and fix these only.
,
Clint pattlrson _ Ibb3b Manniteau Street N. W.
Stated that he has not been able to get into his property for sometimes
, .
several days; and suggested that part of the $3,000.00 be used to flX
this stretch of road.
I
Walter Arntzen - City Building Official and Road Supervisor - The City is
. ,
spending tWice as much time grading the roads in the Rus sell area as they
are in anyone other part of the City. Are the residents going to be satisfied
if we only do a "patch" job? The Postmaster in Anoka wants the problem
solved, an6 stated to me that if there were no satisfactory solutions after
this Hearibg, the mailboxes may be moved out to 7th Avenue because they
were havijg such a problem getting into the area.
Councilpe I son Holasek - If we do just the minimum, what will happen next
spring if tie roads get bad again.
Don Anderson _ 16610 Zuni Street N. W.
Stated that he had lived in the area since 1969, and even though he could
get in o his place, he had helped several people who had gotten stuck just
beyon hi slot.
Dean Lipp - 16631 Zuni Street N. W.
Stated that ditches and culverts should be put in to help take care of the
water
Wayne Rus.sell - 163rd Lane N. W.
Noted 'that the roads were getting deeper ruts and harder to drive each
week; and was in favor of at least graveling the roads per the proposal.
Gonml di"'O".f ...u.d Un '""'" if "'lb Avonu, wo.. ¡.n uo, uf lb. p.oj.",
Mr. Kasma stat d that $16,000 would cover the gravel and spreading of same in
the balance of th area; however, this would not include any ditching, culverts,
or engineering a, d administrative costs. Other discus sion covered the ability
of emergency vehicles getting into the area, and the possibility of using a ":road-mix"
of sand and rockl or cinders Several residents noted that they would rather have
blacktop than gr~vel if given a choice.
Public Hearing ;une l2, L .5
Minutes - Page 5
MOTION by VanderLaan, that the City Council direct the City Engineer to prepare
final plans and ~pecifications for the construction of Class #5 gravel roads in the
,
entire Russell Addition as outlined in Mr. Kasma's letter of June 12, 1975.
No second.
The following persons suggested that the $3,000 be used to fix the streets as listed:
D. Anderjon - 200' on Zuni Street between l65th and l66th.
C. Patterson - 600' on Manniteau !'lvd. N.W.
M. Gieseke - 500' on Yakima Street N. W.
W. Russell _ 600' on South Zuni Street, 400' on 163rd Lane, and 200' on South
I Argon Street.
MOTION by Rither, seconded by VanderLaan, that the City Council direct the Engineer
to prepare final1plans and specifications for construction of Class #5 gravel roads
,
throughout the Russell Addition, City of Andover, as outlined in a report to the
,
City Council, dated June 12, 1975, with the following exception: 165th Avenue N. W.
from the interse'ction of 7th Avenue, westerly to Yakima Street.
The residents wlre asked for a show of hands on 1) do they want the roads as stated in
the aforementiorted motion, or would they rather have 2) blacktop. The majority of
residents indicated that they would prefer Item #2. The question was asked of the
engineer, that if] the roads were graded and graveled now, could they be blacktopped
in a year or two with no additional gravel needed. Mr. Kasma informed the audience
that additional gtavel would be required at the time of blacktopping.
MOTION by Win schitl, seconded by Schneider, to table the motion made by
Council person Rither, seconded by Councilperson VanderLaan, to a continued
Public Hearing f Street Improvement in Russell Addition on June 18, 1975,
9 :00 P. M., And ver City Hall, 1685 Crosstown Boulevard N. W. Vote: Yes, Schneider,
VanderLaan, Wi dschitl; No, Holasek, Rither. Motion carried.
Hearing continued to 9 :00 P. M., June 18, 1975 -- 11:55 P.M.
Patricia K. Lin' quist
Clerk/Treasure
TKDJ\. TOm, KING, DUVALL, ANDERSON AND ASSOCIATES INCORPORATED
I !:NOIN!:!:RS AND ARCHITECTS
,
1408 PIONEER BUILDING !
SAINT PAUL, MINNESOTA
June 12, 1975 55101 224-7891
RICHAJltO M. BA~K[R
OW!:N J. BEATTY
OARREL. H. BERKOWITZ
, ROBERT A. BOVE"
JAMES C. BROTEN
ARNOT J. OUVALL.
!1UGO Q. aRICKSON
WILLIAM J. ,'IEVDER
ROYCE B. HANSEN
STEPHEN M. HARTL.I£Y
CLIII'FORD E. JOHN_Of'.¡
CuWAYN£ R. KASMA
J. THOMAS KIRK
CAVle W. K!RKWOLC
A. DEAN LUNDHOLM
"OBERT T. ~A'-ONEY
"'CHARD D. MENKEN
LII:ONAJltD O. MILLEA
WAYNE A. OLSON
DUANE T. PREW
~UDOL.PH p, RA.tTOR
ROBERT R. RYOER
WILL,,,,", T. SHERIDAN
ABE J. SPERLING
ARNOLD M. STEFf'r:S
WALTER W. THORPE
JAMES E. VOYEN
NATHAN P. WEBER
GEORGI!. J. SCHRO!.P,Eft
Dear Resident: t::LIFFORD W. HAMBLIN
,he City Council i conducting a Public Hearing on June 12, 1975 at 9:00 P.M?
to discuss the feas 'bility of constructing gravel or bituminous surfaced streets
in the Russell Add tion, City of Andover. The attached map shows the location
of these streets.
T he following info mation is presented on the proposed project:
1) eet construction would be proposed for our area?
A street projec in your area would include shaping the existing dirt streets
to provide proper drainage and placing 4" of Class V gravel at a 20' width to
provide a main ainablc driving surface. We have also included, as on al-
ternate, the co struction of a 20' wide bituminous roadway at a 1-1/2" thickness.
The life expect ney of the street, with proper sealcoating and crackfilling.
is 10 to 20 yea s.
2) What is the pr posed time schedule of the City to install central sanitary
sewer alld wat<jrmain systems in this area?
f -.-¡
The City of An over Plan:,ing and Zoning Commission and City Council
hav" complC'te the ComprehC'!Isiv" Development Plan for thC' City.
'1'1,., ComlI,.'iwnHivl' PIA1\ l'o1\tain~ an Urhan Pla\\nin~ DiHtl'irt whi<'h ,'onHi"IH
01 111.. I"nd /oI1,,,i'rally "ollth of Honnd Lak,' and Andovl'" 1101I1..vn,'d. Thi" aI"'",
¡ !
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June 12, 1975 ,
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Page Two
,
,
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is proposed to be served by sanitary sewe rs in the near future by an existing I
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Metropolitan Sewe r Line located on C rooked Lake Boulevard at the south line
of Andover. I i
A recently completec1 Metropolitan Sewer Board study states that the plan for
serving Andove~ should be modified to provide for limiting long range utilization
of the Metropolitan Interceptor to an urban planning district located in the
Southwest area bf the City within a boundary determined by the City.
In summary, tht area in which you live is not planned to be served through
any existing intJrceptor sewers. It will be many years, probably the year
,
2000, before sanitary sewers or any watermain systems are considered for
for your area. I .
3) What steps are necessary to get the work dOl1e?
The following stlps are necessary for the completion of the project: ,
!
,
,
I í !
,
A) City Counci~ hold Public Hearing June 12, 1975
B) City Council orders project, authorizes i
Engineer t1 prepare plans and specifications June 12, 1975 !
C) Engineer s bmits plans for Council approval,
and receive's authorization to advertise for
bids I July 15, 1975 I
D) City Council receives bids and awards
contracts August 5, 1975
E) Contractor begins construction August 11, 1975
F) Contractor completes construction October 1, 1975
G) City Engin¥r prcpares final cost estimates
and assess ent roll October 1, 1975
H) City councr conducts assessment hearing.
Any errors or adjustments in assessments
are made a this meeting. October 14, 1975
I) City Counc'l passes resolution accepting
asseBBmen roll and directs Clerk to file I
with Anoka County Auditor before October ,
,
15, 1975. October 14, 1975
4) How much will the street project cost me?
The City Engin~er has prepared a preliminary cost estimate and feasibility
report on the proposed project.
I
The preliminary cost estimate for gravel surfacing is $ 32,3000.00 and for
,
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"_(Ie 12, 1975 I
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Page Three I
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bituminous surfa~ing is $82,2000.00.
I
The entire cost of this improvement would be assessed on an adjusted
front footage basis to all abutting properties. Adjusted front footages
will include provisions for corner lots and irregular shaped lots.
I
Based on the preliminary cost estimates and a total frong f~ota!5f of 19,100
, 32 00
feet, the front foot assessment for gravel streets would b"!9 {oo.t 1 = $1. 75/F.F.
and for bituminous streets would be 4~2, 200 T= $4.50 IF. F. '
I ,¡OU F
The assessment for an average lot 200 feet in width would then be 200 feet
times $1. 75 equals $350.00 for gravel or 200 times $4.50 equals $900,00 for
bituminous const~uction. The assessment could be paid in full, or paid on
an installment ba'sis with property taxes over a 10 or 15 year period. The
annual charges, based on an assessment and 80/, annual interest, would be as
follow s: ¡
Year Grave' Street Construction Bituminous street con~t~~_~.~i0L.._
10 yea'r 15 yea r 10 year 15 year
I Assessments Assessments Assessments
Assessments
1976 I $51.33 $162,00 $132.00
$63,O~
1977 60.2 I 49.46 154.80 127.20
1978 57.40 47.64 147.60 122.40 ¡
,
1979 54.60 45.77 140.40 117.60
1980 51.80 43.90 133.20 112.80
1981 49.00 42.03 126.00 108.00
1982 46.20 40.16 118.50 103.20
1983 43.4C 38.29 111.60 98.40
1984 40.6C , 36.42 104.40 Q3.60
1985 37.8C 34.55 97.20 88.00
1986 32.68 84.00
1987 30.81 79.20
1988 28.93 I 74.40
1989 27.06 69.60
1990 i 25.20 ¡ 64.80
I
'I W~<OiO[ '0' !hi, Hmo!
Tht' ('onatru{,tioo indutitry prict'" havt' l'ontih\U' to l"iHt' in 11\(· paHt yt'<l 1"/"1 , ólnd
tl(· 011110,,1, Is {OJ "ontinu"d hl!(h<,r p1'Ì<,,·s. TIH' En!(in<'<'rinh N"WH H"""rd
Cost Index, whic,h is a national publication that indicates cost trends in "0"-
une 12, 1975
Page Four
struction, lists ¡the following increases in recent years ba.sed on $100.00
worth of construction in 1965:
Year ]?ase of $100.00 Percent increases per year
1965 $ 100.00
1966 103.87 3.9
1967 108.90 4.8
1968 116.07 6.6
1969 127.64 10.0
1970 136.60 7.0
1971 152.98 12.0
1972 173.74 13.6
1973 190.84 9.8
1974 202.19 5.9
If a project is needed, it is reasonable to proceed with the project as soon as
)ossible to obtain ~he benefit of the improvement, since the interest at 80/, will
probably be less t an the annual increased construction cost.
As your City COn~Ulting Engineers, we hope this letter answers some of your
questions regarding this proposed street project.
Very truly yours,
TOLTZ, KlliG, DUVALL, ANDERSON
AND ASSOCIATES, INCORPORATED
~~j1:t:.f:K~
DRK:vlo
cc: Mrs. Pat indquist, Clerk-T reasure r
Mr. Walt r Arntzen, Building Inspector
Andover ity Council
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