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1685 CROSSTOWN BOULEVARD N.W. . ANDOVER, MINNESOTA 55304 . (763) 755-5100
FAX (763) 755-8923 . WWW.CI.ANDOVER.MN.US
Regular City Council Meeting - Tuesday, July I, 2003
Call to Order - Following EDA Meeting at 6:30 p.m.
Pledge of Allegiance
Resident Forum
Agenda Approval
1. North Metro Mayors Legislative Presentation
2. Anoka County Mediation Services Presentation
3. Approval of Minutes (6/17/03 Regular Meeting)
Consent Items
4. Approve Payment of Claims - Finance
5. Approve Kennel License Renewals - Clerk
6. Amend Ordinance 235/Intoxicating Liquor/Compliance Check Violation FeeslBar Closing - Clerk
7. Amend Ordinance 213/Non-Intoxicating Liquor/Compliance Check Violation Fees/Hours of Sale - Clerk
8. Amend Ordinance 260/Fee Schedule - Clerk
9. Award Bid/02-45/Constance Comers - Engineering
10. Approve Release of Letter of Credit #3 I 460-AlPlans & Specs/02-45/Constance Corners - Finance
II. Reduce Escrow/Developer Improvements/Maple Hollow - Engineering
12. Accept Revised Feasibility Reportl03-18/16150 Crosstown Boulevard NW (Constance Free Church)-
Engineering
13. Appoint Project ArchitectlFire Station #3 - Fire
14. Approve Final PlatINorth Lake Ridge - Planning
15. Approve Raffle PermitlMetro North Chamber Foundation (Supplemental) - Clerk
Discussion Items
16. Discuss Round Lake Study/03-11 - Engineering
17. Discuss Rural Reserve Area North of 161" Avenue NW -Planning/Engineering
18. Consider Youth First Donation - Finance
19. Consider Waiving FeeIToumamentlRiverdale AG - Engineering
20. Consider Street & Utility Easement/Woodland Estates 4th Addition - Engineering
21. Consider Premises PermitlLawful Gambling! Andover Baseball Assn. - Clerk
22. Consider Ordinance Amendment! Accessory Structures/Right-of- Way for Area Calculation - Planning
23. Consider Ordinance AmendmentlResidential Building StandardslIncrease Allowable Post and Beam
Construction - Planning
StaffItem
24. Consider Legal Opinion/Conceal & Carry Legislation - Administration
25. Community Center Project Update - Administration
Mayor/Council Input
Adjournment
.
Regular Andover City Council Meeting
Minutes - July 1, 2003
REGULAR ANDOVER CITY COUNCIL MEETING MINUTES - JULY I, 2003
TABLE OF CONTENTS
PLEDGE OF ALLEGIENCE ..................................................................................................... I
RESIDENT FORUM..................................................................................................................1
AGENDA APPROV AL .............................................................................................................2
NORTH METRO MAYORS LEGISLATIVE PRESENTATION ............................................3
ANOKA COUNTY MEDIATION SERVICES PRESENTATION ..........................................3
APPROVAL OF MINUTES.......................................................................................................4
CONSENT ITEMS
Approve Payment of Claims.................................................................................................4
Approve Kennel License Renewals ......................................................................................4
Amend Ordinance 235/Intoxicating Liquor/Compliance Check Violation Fees/Bar
Closing (Ordinance 235D) .............................................................................................4
Amend Ordinance 213/Non-Intoxicating Liquor/Compliance Check Violation Fees!
Hours of Sale (Ordinance 213B) ...................................................................................4
Amend Ordinance 260/Fee Schedule (Ordinance 260G)....................................................4
Resolution R134-03 awarding Bid/Constance Comers........................................................4
Approve Release of Letter of Credit #31460-AlPlans & Specs!02-45/Constance Comers..4
Reduce Escrow/Developer ImprovementslMaple Hollow ...................................................4
Resolution R135-03 accepting Revised Feasibility Report/03-18/16150 Crosstown
Boulevard NW (Constance Free Church) ........................................................................4
Appoint Project ArchitectlFire Station #3 ............................................................................4
Resolution R136-03 approving Final PlatINorth Lake Ridge ..............................................4
Approve Raffle PermitlMetro North Chamber Foundation..................................................4
DISCUSS ROUND LAKE STUDY/03-11
Motion Authorizing and Analysis..........................................................................................4
DISCUSS RURAL RESERVE AREA NORTH OF 161 ST AVENUE NW
Motion to Hold Open House..................................................................................................6
CONSIDER WAIVING FEE/TOURNAMENT/RIVERDALE AIG
Motion to Deny Request........................................................................................................7
CONSIDER STREET & UTILITY EASEMENT/WOODLAND ESTATES 4111 ADDITION
Motion to approve .................................................................................................................8
CONSIDER PREMISES PERMIT/LA WFUL GAMBLING/ANDOVER BASEBALL
ASSOCIATION
Motion to Table .....................................................................................................................9
CONSIDER ORDINANCE AMENDMENT/ACCESSORY STRUCTURE/RIGHT-OF-
WAY FOR AREA CALCULATION
Motion to Make No Changes.................................................................................................1 0
CONSIDER ORDINANCE AMENDMENTS/RESIDENTIAL BUILDING STANDARDS/
INCREASE ALLOW ABLE POST AND BEAM CONSTRUCTION
Motion to Table ......................................................................................................................11
CONSIDER LEGAL OPTIONS/CONCEAL & CARRY LEGISLATION ...............................12
-- ~ ..---"-
Regular Andover City Council Meeting
Minutes - July 1, 2003
. -
Regular Andover City Council Meeting Minutes - July 1, 2003
Table of Contents
Page ii
COMMUNITY CENTER PROJECT UPDATE ........................................................................13
MA YORlCOUNCIL INPUT
Fun Fest Activities .................................................................................................................14
Letter from Mr. Povlitski .......................................................................................................14
Bluebird Street Complaint .....................................................................................................14
7th A venue Closing ................................................................................................................14
National Night Out/City Council Meeting Date Changes .....................................................14
ADJOURNMENT ..................................................................................................................14
1685 CROSSTOWN BOULEVARD N.W. . ANDOVER, MINNESOTA 55304 . (763) 755-5100
FAX (763) 755-8923 . WWW.CI.ANDOVER.MN.US
REGULAR ANDOVER CITY COUNCIL MEETING - JULY I, 2003
MINUTES
The Regular Bi-Monthly Meeting of the Andover City Council was called to order by Mayor Mike
Gamache, July I, 2003, 7:02 p.m., at the Andover City Hall, 1685 Crosstown Boulevard NW,
Andover, MinnesotL
Councilmembers present: Don Jacobson, Mike Knight, Ken Orttel
Councilmember absent: Julie Trude
Also present: City Attorney, William Hawkins
City Engineer, Dave Berkowitz
City Finance Director, Jim Dickinson
Community Development Director, Will Neumeister
City Administrator, John Erar
Others
PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
RESIDENT FORUM
Ms. Kathv Yamauchi. 13914 Goldenrod. Wendy Hanson. 13900 Goldenrod. Dina Dupre. 13774
Goldenrod, stated they have seriolÌS concerns about excessive speeding on Goldenrod. One of the
solutions was to buy plastic slow men to put in the driveways when the kids are out to play during
the day. Ms. Yamauchi stated the displays are plastic and do not have any sharp edges on them. Last
week they received a letter from the City explaining that they need to move the signs up eight feet
ITom the roadway but this seemed like a ways away ITom the road and would not be as visible. She
explained she talked to Mr. Neumeister regarding this and was told they could not have anything
over three feet tall at the end of the driveways and she measured the signs and they are less than three
feet tall. They are trying to make a point to get people to slow down and to be more observant in the
area. Mr. Neumeister and Mr. Haas told her they would have the sheriff patrol the block in the next
couple of weeks to monitor the speed on the street. She thought this sign was important for the
safety of the kids and would like the Council to consider them using these signs at the end of their
driveways and to lower the speed limit on the block to twenty miles an hour or have another stop
sign at 139th Lane.
Coundlmember Jacobson asked since they put the signs up if there has been any change. Ms.
Yamauchi stated there has been and when people see the signs they automatically slow down.
Councilmember Jacobson asked if they were going under the sign ordinance with this item. Mr.
Neumeister stated Ordinance 106 regulates boulevard use and that is where the encroachment
Regular Andover City Council Meeting
Minutes - July 1, 2003
Page 2
restriction comes up. Councilmember Jacobson asked if they could allow them to display the signs.
Mr. Neumeister suggested they amend the boulevard use of Ordinance 106 to allow this.
Councilmember Knight stated there are other obstacles that really have never been enforced.
Councilmember Orttel stated they have by complaint but he thought that either the Ordinance should
be amended or find room in it for this because he did not know how this would be bad for the City.
Councilmember Knight stated he liked this and thought they should work on the ordinance and make
the change. City Attorney Hawkins explained this was where they needed to make the change and
would need some review so there are not a number of signs out there.
Mayor Gamache asked if they could administratively do this and in the meantime, they could be
allowed to display the signs. Mr. Neumeister stated they tried to compromise by allowing them to be
five feet from the roadway because the flag.
Motion by Jacobson to allow the residents to display the sign subject to some setback until the next
meeting with review by staff.
There was no second to the motion so the motion died.
Councilmember Orttel stated this is not an improvement to the boulevard because the signs are
temporary.
Mr. Berkowitz stated State Statute sets the speed limit in urban areas to 30 miles per hour and the
City cannot change this. A traffic study can be done but it does not mean the speed limit will be
lowered.
AGENDA APPROVAL
Agenda Item 18 (Consider Youth First Donation) was tabled.
Councilmember Jacobson explained there was a drafting error on Item 14, which could be corrected
without moving it down for discussion.
Motion by Jacobson, Seconded by Knight, to approve the Agenda as amended above. Motion
carried unanimously.
NORTH METRO MAYORS LEGISLATIVE PRESENTATION
Mr. Steve Larson, President of North Metro Mayors Association and Mayor of New Brighton, stated
they are at the meeting to answer questions the Council may have about what they actually do.
Mr. Larson explained with all of the lobbying at the State level, a lot of the cities did not get hit
Regular Andover City Council Meeting
Minutes - July 1, 2003
Page 3
as hard as the government wanted to hit them and he felt that was partly because of their presence
at the Capitol.
Ms. Sara Epert, Executive Director of North Metro Mayors Association, discussed what the
Association has been involved in up and prior to the 2002 election and some of the items that
have been taking place during the legislative process this session.
Mr. Bob Benke discussed LGA cuts with the Council. He showed several charts and discussed
each chart with the Council.
Mayor Gamache wanted to commend the work the North Metro Mayors Association has done for
Andover this year and he thought organizing the North Metro representatives was a great project.
Councilmember Jacobson asked what the stand of the North Metro Mayors Association is
regarding the livable communities act with the Metropolitan Council. Ms. Epert explained their
stand on livable communities is that all communities of the North Metro Mayors Association are
participants of livable communities with the exception of one community. She stated they do not
have an official position but it is a strong belief in the position and the policy. Councilmember
Orttel explained they agreed to disagree on this item when they rejoined.
Mayor Gamache stated that one of the issues which has come up before is we may be the last city
left not in livable communities; we fit all of the criteria but are not in the program.
Councilmember Orttel stated there has been a change in leadership at the Metropolitan Council
and it is his understanding that there has not been a great deal of change in the mission as defined
by the past administration. Mr. Larson stated they retained four people from the previous
committee and with the redistricting and them having to reelect two more positions that were
phased out with the redistricting he thinks there is so much turmoil over doing all that that they
are basically going with the plans that were established prior.
Mr. Erar noted from a staff perspective North Metro Mayors Association demands a great deal of
respect and attention by the legislation.
ANOKA COUNTY MEDIATION SERVICES PRESENTATION
Ms. Linda Buda, Mediation Services of Anoka County, discussed the mediation services for Anoka
County. She explained they have been in service for sixteen years and are funded by the State,
County, City and Government Grants through the United Way. She discussed with the Council some
of the different programs they have.
Mayor Gamache noted on September 11, 2003 they will be having a benefit at the Lyric Arts
Main Street Stage from 5:00 p.m. to 9:00 p.m. and hors d'oeuvres and a silent auction will be
followed by a theatrical production of "On Golden Pond".
Regular Andover City Council Meeting
Minutes - July 1, 2003
Page 4
APPROVAL OF MINUTES
June 17, 2003, Regular Meeting: Correct as written.
Motion by Knight, Seconded by Jacobson, approval of Minutes as indicated above. Motion carried
unanimously.
CONSENT ITEMS
Item 4 Approval of Claims
Item 5 Approve Kennel License Renewals
Item 6 Amend Ordinance 235/Intoxicating Liquor/Compliance Check Violation Fees/Bar
Closing (Ordinance 235D)
Item 7 Amend Ordinance 213/Non-Intoxicating Liquor/Compliance Check Violation
Fees/Hours of Sale (Ordinance 213B)
Item 8 Amend Ordinance 260/Fee Schedule (Ordinance 260G)
Item 9 Award Bid/02-45/Constance Comers (See Resolution R134-03)
Item 10 Approve Release of Letter of Credit #31460-AlPlans & Specs!02-45/Constance
Comers
Item 11 Reduce Escrow/Developer ImprovementslMaple Hollow
Item 12 Accept Revised Feasibility Report/03-18/16150 Crosstown Boulevard NW
(Constance Free Church) (See Resolution R135-03)
Item 13 Appoint Project ArchitectlFire Station #3
Item 14 Approve Final PlatINorth Lake Ridge (See Resolution RI36-03)
Item 15 Approve Raffle PerrnitlMetro North Chamber Foundation
Motion by Jacobson, Seconded by Knight, approval of the Consent Agenda as read. Motion carried
unanimously.
DISCUSS ROUND LAKE STUDY/03-II
City Engineer Berkowitz explained the Anoka Conservation District (ACD) along with the
Department of Natural Resources (DNR) has been studying the water levels of Round Lake.
Mr. Jamie Schurbon, Anoka Conservation District, discussed the interim report from the ACD and
the DNR regarding Round Lake with the City Council.
Councilmember Orttel asked what held the water in the past from flowing into the Rum River if the
beaver ditch was not there. He also wondered if the ditch was dug or natural. Mr. Schurbon stated it
is a natural waterway that has at sometime been improved. Mr. Berkowitz explained he believed
,
Regular Andover City Council Meeting
Minutes - July 1, 2003
Page 5
there was a ditch there and then when Indian Meadows 4th addition was constructed a culvert was
constructed underneath Elderado Street.
Discussion ensued in regard to the level of the lake in the past and now.
Councilmember Knight asked if what people are saying that the lake is lower is incorrect. Mr.
Schurbon stated the lake is lower than it has been in the past but it is also higher than it has been in
the past. Councilmember Knight asked if the fluctuation in the lake is more than the three inches he
was talking about. Mr. Schurbon stated the lake will fluctuate freely based on the climate conditions
and other factors.
Councilmember Jacobson stated one of the points made was water was running under 7th Avenue
into ditches and from reading the report, the highway department has not come back to say yes or no
but the indication he has read is that it really is not going to make any difference because it is not
substantially different than it was before. The ditches on the other side do not have any impact on
the flow at all. Mr. Schurbon explained there is no part of the report that he authored regarding this
but Mr. Tom Hovey of the DNR discussed it in the report. It is not necessarily saying the ditches are
not an influence, they still may be. Councilmember Jacobson asked if the survey that the County is
taking on that issue settles the matter or is it just more information. Mr. Schurbon stated it is more
information and there are other issues that will still be worked on and open.
Ms. Sonsteby explained she was never invited to the meetings on the north side of Round Lake. She
showed the Council pictures of Round Lake stating Round Lake will be history. She explained there
used to be a clay factory on the west side of Round Lake and on her side it was all clay. She stated
they put the overflow of Round Lake over to her property and she has had an engineer working on
this also.
Ms. Sonsteby read what he said to her about the lake.
Ms. Sonsteby stated she has a lot of information regarding this and she will be making an issue of
this later on and will be making her information public.
Ms. Sonsteby discussed the history and what has happened to the area around Round Lake.
Motion by Orttel, Seconded by Jacobson, authorizing conducting an analysis of the affected
properties and what impact if any a permanent ditch block or weir structure would have on these
areas.
Councilmember Jacobson asked where the money would come ITom. Mr. Berkowitz explained they
do have funds available in the Lower Rum River Watershed Management Organization Special
Revenue Fund. Councilmember Jacobson asked if this fund was the city's or the Watershed
Organizations. Mr. Berkowitz stated he believed it was the city's fund but he would clarify it with
Mr. Dickinson.
Regular Andover City Council Meeting
Minutes - July 1, 2003
Page 6
Councilmember Knight asked how much it would cost. Mr. Berkowitz stated it would be in the two
to five thousand dollar range but they did not have a solid number.
Councilmember Jacobson asked how long it would take and would they need the information from
the highway department study along 7th A venue in order to do their own study. Mr. Berkowitz stated
they would not because they are mainly studying the issue of the beaver dam.
Motion carried unanimously.
DISCUSS RURAL RESERVEAREA NORTH OF I6IsT A VENUE NW
Community Development Director Neumeister explained the City has been studying the area north
of 161" Avenue that was shown as an area of88 acres that was left ambiguous as to exactly where
the "Rural Reserve" boundaries would be placed.
Mr. Neumeister discussed general information and issues that staff has identified that may need
further study, and may have a bearing on the fmal selection.
Councilmember Jacobson stated that unless some of the land is developed with adjoining property
owners, there will only be one entrance and exit. He asked staff to take a look at the idea of not
using gravity but to use all forced mains and make it a uniform system because they have had some
problems before.
Councilmember Knight asked how long the lots are and what is the point of having them so long.
Councilmember Orttel explained the option to be is to take the low areas and use them for drainage
easements.
Motion by Orttel, Seconded by Knight, to authorize staff to hold an open house meeting with the
remaining property owners that are located in the remaining "Rural Reserve" area north of 161 ,t
A venue. Motion carried unanimously.
CONSIDER WAIVING FEE/TOURNAMENTIRIVERDALE AlG
City Engineer Berkowitz explained this item is in regard to considering waiving the fee for the
tournament for the 2nd Annual Riverdale STL Classic as requested by Riverdale AIG.
The tournament has been approved by the Park Commission for Saturday, September 6, 2003 for
Fields 5-8 at Sunshine Park. However, the Park Commission did not recommend waiving the fee.
The Commission did not waive the fee due to the fact that the church is requiring a toumament entrY
fee of$135.00.
Councilmember Orttel stated they have encountered this before and if they waive for one, they have
Regular Andover City Council Meeting
Minutes - July 1, 2003
Page 7
to waive for all non-profit. City Attorney Hawkins stated this was true and they have to treat
everyone in an equal manner.
Motion by Jacobson, Seconded by Orttel, to deny waiving the fee as requested by Riverdale AIG.
Mr. Tim Hale explained he went through the Park Commission and he wanted to let them know it is
a non-profit organization. He stated they are charging a fee of $135.00 which is for the Youth
Ministry at Riverdale Assembly of God and the Organization is called "Speed the Light". He
explained what Speed the Light Youth Ministry does.
Mayor Gamache asked if they had a copy of how they advertise the tournament. Mr. Hale showed
the advertisement from last year to the Council and explained this year's ad will look the same as last
years except the date and location will be different. Mayor Gamache asked how they advertise this
to the teens and if there are prizes. Mr. Hale stated they give out trophies to each division and this is
the northern area Speed the Light tournament.
Councilmember Orttel stated Mr. Hale's passion is obvious and the mission is commendable but he
looks at it that the idea of collecting the fees is to recover the city's costs for the fields and if they do
not collect the fee it would be considered a donation to his institution which they are not supposed to
do legally. He sees problems that are not worth the City facing if they waived the fees.
Councilmember Jacobson asked if they have looked at Meadow Creek for ball fields. Mr. Hale
stated they have not approached them because Sunshine Park is so close to their church and the fields
at Meadow Creek are not fenced in.
Mayor Gamache asked if in advertising this tournament that it is recognized as being held at a City
park and all the City regulations need to be met. Mr. Hale stated they did and it was a church only
event so there would not be any liquor on the premises.
Mayor Gamache asked City Attorney Hawkins if the reason why they don't waive the fees for one
organization and not others is because it is precedent setting. City Attorney Hawkins stated that is
correct and they do not distinguish between different organizations.
Motion carried unanimously.
Mr. Hale asked if there was a way to reduce the fee. Mr. Berkowitz explained because this was a day
toumament the fees would be reduced by twenty five percent but they could not reduce it any further.
Mayor Gamache stated all the fees are set by Ordinance so there is not a way to adjust the fees.
Mr. Hale asked if they could get the use of the concession stand in the park. Mr. Dickinson stated
the City has a contract with the current concessionaire who has exclusive operation of that facility.
One thing they have for tournaments is revenue sharing participation for the weekend tournaments.
He stated there is no charge to the Organization for this.
Regular Andover City Council Meeting
Minutes - July 1, 2003
Page 8
CONSIDER STREET & UTILITY EASEMENT /WOODLAND ESTATES 4TH ADDITION
City Engineer Berkowitz explained this item is in regard to consider accepting the proposed Quit
Claim Deed from Ken & Mary Ann Slyzuk and Woodland Development Corporation for the
construction of a temporary cul-de-sac.
Mr. Berkowitz stated this request is being made by the developer to avoid having the temporary cul-
de-sac located directly in front of the platted lots, which will eventually be built on and to avoid
future restoration of driveways and yards. Also, allowing the temporary cul-de-sac to be constructed
further west eliminates future retrofitting of stonn sewer that will be constructed in the next few
weeks. City staff recommends as a condition to the approval the developer shall include as part of
the purchase agreement for each lot, that each buyer within the development acknowledges that the
west end of 152nd Lane NW and north end of Quinn Street NW are temporary cul-de-sacs and are
anticipated to serve adjoining properties that may be developed in the future.
Motion by Knight, Seconded by Jacobson, to approve the Quit Claim Deed for the street easement
subject to the developer including within the purchase agreement of each lot the acknowledgement
that the west end of 152nd Lane NW and the north end of Quinn Street NW are temporary cul-de-sacs
within the development and are anticipated to serve adjoining properties that may be developed in
the future and to accept the easement with the language restricting access to the easement for
building purposes.
Councilmember Jacobson asked if the area that the temporary cul-de-sac will be placed into is in or
out of the Rural Reserve. Mr. Berkowitz explained it is out of Rural Reserve but in Ag Preserve.
Councilmember Jacobson stated this quit claim deed is strictly for the road right-of-way and by
doing this they are not granting any additional lots outside of the plat. Mr. Berkowitz stated this was
true. Councilmember Orttel stated they could make note of this because down the road there could
be new owners who would want to build and they would have the legal right to do so.
Councilmember Jacobson asked if they do this, and they do have a constructed road the City owns, is
there any legal basis for denying building permits on the road. City Attorney Hawkins explained if
they have access and it is maintained, the City would have to allow them to construct a building on it
unless there is language in the document.
Councilmember Knight asked if the legal language could be added to the motion. Councilmember
Jacobson stated if they accept the deed, the City Attorney would look at it and put the wording in so
they cannot build on it.
Councilmember Orttel stated the Council is only accepting the deed so would they put it in the deed.
City Attorney Hawkins stated they should put the wording in the easement document itself and
make reference to the land where it governs and restricts the access.
Regular Andover City Council Meeting
Minutes - July 1, 2003
Page 9
Mr. Berkowitz noted on page six of the item under Schedule A, Legal Description, it does talk about
a sixty-six foot temporary easement for road purposes over and under across the part of the north half
so he did not know if they needed additional language to that. Councilmember Orttel stated there
needed to be language in there stating it could not be built on until it is platted.
Motion carried unanimously.
CONSIDER PREMISES PERMITILAWFUL GAMBLING/ANDOVER BASEBALL
ASSOCIATION
The Andover Baseball Association has submitted a premises permit application for Council to
consider that would allow them to conduct lawful gambling at Tanner's Steakhouse. The lease
amount will be $1,000 plus $750.00 for utilities. The gambling manager is not yet licensed but will
be by the end of July.
Councilmember Orttel stated he thought they should postpone approving this until the gambling
manager is licensed.
Councilmember Jacobson stated they should also get the utility costs. Mayor Gamache stated there
has been a recent change in the state law where the amount would be combined and not separated
out. City Attorney Hawkins stated he thought this was correct and a cap of$I,750.00 a month was
placed on this.
Mayor Gamache stated the City would like to have the same reports that the State receives each
month. Mr. Dickinson stated they City will be getting those monthly for their reporting to the State
and he can forward those reports to the Council.
Mayor Gamache stated he agreed with Councilmember Orttel and he would like to have someone go
through the program and be licensed before they approve this. The Andover Baseball Association
representative stated Tanners Steakhouse would like to get this started by the beginning of August
and he thought what the situation would be that the City needs to approve it in order for them to send
in a premise permit which would push it back into September. Mayor Gamache stated this was
possible. Councilmember Orttel stated the Ordinance prohibits them ttom issuing anyone who does
not have a license to approve a premise permit but they could authorize this but not approve it until
they had somebody licensed.
Motion by Orttel, Seconded by Jacobson, to table this item until July 15,2003 to research the
changes in State law.
Councilmember Jacobson asked if the State does background checks on the gambling managers.
Councilmember Orttel stated they do.
Motion carried unanimously.
Regular Andover City Council Meeting
Minutes-July 1,2003
Page 10
CONSIDER ORDINANCE AMENDMENT/ACCESSORY STRUCTURES/RlGHT-OF-WAY
FOR AREA CALCULATION
Community Development Director Neumeister explained the City Council has directed staff to
investigate the possibility of allowing right-of-way to be used in calculating lot area for determining
the allowable square footage of accessory structures.
Councilmember Orttel asked if this is the same terminology they would use for lot area for lot splits.
Mr. Neumeister stated he had not been asked that question but thought they should be consistent.
City Attorney Hawkins stated they should be consistent and if they find some areas that are
inconsistent, they should change those.
Councilmember Orttel asked if it would be better to say "excluding dedicated right-of-way" because
it is how would they determine right-of-way on a meets and bounds lot. City Attorney Hawkins
stated if it was acquired as a result of the road user statute, they would have to calculate based on
what has been used or maintained by the City but he thought that was included so they would go
right to the property line.
Motion by Jacobson, Seconded by Knight, to make no changes to Ordinance 8, Section 4.05 (Cl).
Motion carried unanimously.
CONSIDER ORDINANCE AMENDMENT/RESIDENTIAL BUILDING
STANDARDSIlNCREASE ALLOWABLE POST AND BEAM CONSTRUCTION
Cornmunity Development Director Neumeister explained and update to the Residential Building
Standards section of ordinance 8. This change would allow residents to construct four-season
porches without permanent foundations provided the porch does not exceed a maximum coverage of
fifty (50%) percent of the footprint of the habitable portion of the principal structure.
CounciImember Knight asked if this only included four-season and not any other. Mr. Neumeister
stated this was true. Councilmember Orttel stated fifty percent seemed large.
Mr. Erar asked if this would also allow people to add onto their homes without a foundation.
Councilmember Orttel stated he read this and it only included four season porches.
Motion by Orttel, Seconded by Knight, to amend Ordinance 8, Section 8.23 (A) to increase the size
of the four-season porches to 50% of the habitable portion of the principal structure.
Councilmember Knight stated he does not have a problem with this other than it seems that they
should have some provision in it preventing it from including bedrooms or a mother-in-law
apartment. Councilmember OrtteI stated they should have a definition included regarding four-
Regular Andover City Council Meeting
Minutes - July 1, 2003
Page 11
season porches and there should be a mention of not allowing plumbing to be installed.
Councilmember Jacobson stated as written it states "All structures should have a regular foundation
except four-season", so does this mean that if someone wants a three-season, they have to have a
foundation under it. Councilmember Orttel stated he thought porches came under a different part of
the code and residents are allowed to put them on posts or piers. Mr. Neumeister stated he would ask
Mr. Almgren about this see if it could be cleaned up somehow.
Councilmember Jacobson stated the best thing to do is to delay this item until the next meeting to
research the wording on this.
Councilmembers Orttel and Knight withdrew their motion and second.
Motion by Orttel, Seconded by Knight, to table this item until the July 15,2003 meeting for more
clarification. Motion carried unanimously.
CONSIDER LEGAL OPINION/CONCEAL & CARRY LEGISLATION
City Administrator Erar explained at the June 17,2003 Council meeting, organizational policies
regarding conceal and carry legislation were brought to the City Council for acknowledgement.
Council raised questions regarding whether the City had the authority to prohibit the public from
entering into staff work areas with concealed weapons.
Mr. Erar stated in light of the City Attorney's opinion, it does not appear that the City has the
legal authority to prohibit this aspect of the conceal and carry provisions affecting the public's
right to carry concealed weapons into staff work areas in public facilities. It should be noted that
several public agencies are actively prohibiting the public from carrying weapons into public
facilities. As Council is aware, City staff also has expressed their concern in allowing members
of the public from entering into internal staff work areas with concealed weapons.
Mr. Erar explained for purposes of seeking a middle ground on this issue, it is proposed that
signage be allowed to restrict internal access to staff work areas to authorized personnel only and
that signage include language "discouraging" the introduction of concealed weapons into public
facilities by the public.
Councilmember Jacobson stated the only reasonable thing to do is to allow signage to be
installed to restrict internal access to staff work areas to authorized personnel only.
Councilmember Knight agreed.
Councilmember Orttel asked who would decide who is authorized to enter. Councilmember
Jacobson stated staff would.
Regular Andover City Council Meeting
Minutes-July 1,2003
Page 12
Councilmember Orttel stated within a year this will be resolved and he assumed they will remove
public buildings from the law. He stated he did not have a problem with authorized personnel
areas and there should be some level of order that should be maintained in City Hall.
Mayor Gamache stated he agreed that they should look at signage that the work areas are for
authorized personnel only. They could come up with a policy where people would sign in for
meetings and other things so the City staff would know who was in the building.
The City Council recessed at 9:48 p.m.
The City Council reconvened at 9:53 p.m.
COMMUNITY CENTER PROJECT UPDATE
Mr. Erar stated the YMCA has tabled the idea of an indoor water park. They would like to
reserve this option for possible aquatics expansion in the future. The YMCA has also indicated
that they will not be providing physical space for teen activities but they will continue to provide
teen center programs but would not have a dedicated space in the center for the activities. The
YMCA staff continues to raise questions about their debt service portion of the facility and in
general how the City can assist them in financing the cost of fitness center equipment. The
YMCA acknowledges their fiscal responsibility in paying for their fair share of the facility and
staff does not anticipate or contemplate any hurdles that are unmanageable at this point.
Councilmember Jacobson stated they could still continue to talk about the City helping them out
with the equipment but he is a little concerned about that. If they go ahead and do this, it should
be included in a general bond if legally allowed. He wants to make sure they are up front about
how much this will cost. Mr. Erar stated the YMCA is not looking for financial subsidy in terms
of the City paying for the equipment but they are continuing to explore how the City can assist
them. The City has been pretty firm in their position that the fitness equipment is part of the
financial responsibility and they acknowledge that and he believed their recent meeting with the
YMCA suggested that the City prefer that the YMCA look at means that they have at their
disposal to fmance their portion of the equipment. The City does not have the legal means of
fmancing it through a long-term revenue bond. He stated the only other means would be to
release equipment certificates; however they have the same ability on their end to issue similar
debt serve instruments.
Councilmember Knight asked if there is a Mother Organization that will provide financial
guarantees if the YMCA cannot meet their obligations. Mr. Erar stated the Mother Organization
would be the YMCA Greater Minneapolis and the City would extract the lease guarantees from
the YMCA Greater Minneapolis.
Mr. Erar discussed the name of the facility with the Council. Mr. Erar explained for fund raising
efforts the center would be called "City of Andover/YMCA Community Center" as a generic
Regular Andover City Council Meeting
Minutes - July 1, 2003
Page 13
reference for the Capital Campaign.
Mr. Erar also discussed the facility schematic design concept and the concession revenue stream
with the Council.
Motion by Orttel, Seconded by Jacobson, authorizing the preliminary plans for moving of the
baseball fields at City Hall to the north end of the site and direct staff to come back with a plan
showing costs and scheduling in August. Motion carried unanimously.
MAYOR/COUNCIL INPUT
(Fun Fest Activities) - Mayor Gamache thanked all the volunteers and City Staffwho worked on Fun
Fest this year and he wanted to thank the Council for being at the booth answering questions.
(Letter from Mr. Povlitski) - Councilmember Knight asked if they wanted to act on Mr. Povlitski's
letter. Mayor Gamache stated they already passed the amendment and he did not think anyone else
would be open past one o'clock.
(Bluebird Street Complaint) - Councilmember Jacobson stated that during the Fun Fest he had a
complaint about the intersection at 150th and Bluebird Street but they have done a study and have
already looked at that issue.
(7'h Avenue Closing) - Councilmember Knight stated after next weekend, 7th A venue will be closed
until October 2003.
(National Night Out/City Council Meeting Date Changes) - Mayor Gamache stated they will need to
change the first City Council meeting in August because National Night Out will be the fIrst Tuesday
in August. Mr. Erar stated this will be added to the next City Council agenda for discussion.
Motion by Orttel, Seconded by Jacobson, to adjourn. Motion carried unanimously. The meeting
adjourned at 10:11 p.m.
Respectfully submitted,
Susan Osbeck, Recording Secretary